Fmr NJ Governor Jim McGreevy on faith, redemption, and a return to politics

Jim McGreevy, former NJ Governor, author, activist joined guest host Harry Hurley on the Guy Benson Show to discuss his faith, redemption, and a potential return to politics through the soon-to-be open Jersey City mayor seat.

Listen to the full interview below:

Full  Transcript below:

Harry Hurley: There are interviews that you just really look forward to, and this is one of them. I’ve been looking forward to this. Governor Jim McGreevey and I have been friends. I went back into my wayback machine. Governor McGreevey and I go back to at least 1995, two years before you lost a nail biter. The polls were completely wrong. They all said that Governor Whitman was going to win by a comfortable, big margin. And this election came down to one percentage point out of millions of votes cast. It was decided by 26,953 votes, an absolute squeaker, which I knew that meant that Jim McGreevey would become the governor of New Jersey four years later. And he did. And oh, by the way, because maybe this is like anti to what is going on in the vitriol of today. I’m a registered Republican. He’s a registered Democrat. I supported publicly the Democrat, Jim McGreevey, against the Republican, Christie Whitman, because I knew that Jim McGreevey was a very, very good man. He is the 52nd governor of the state of New Jersey. In November of 2001, Jim McGreevey was elected governor of New Jersey. And I know from the many interviews that we’ve done, it was something that he really he wanted the job. He wanted to do the job. And then in the year 2004, in a most public manner, explaining to the citizens of New Jersey why he was resigning, Governor McGreevey resigned his position. And I can only imagine, you know, the pain of achieving something that only 51 other people had ever done. And what’s really sad about it all is 20 some years later, no one would resign for for loving someone. So it really is just sort of just the time that this all took place. He is the longtime former mayor of Woodbridge Township for more than a decade, a member of the New Jersey General Assembly, a member of the New Jersey Senate. And I mentioned the governor of the state of New Jersey, Governor McGreevey. Welcome to the Guy Benson Show. It is great to reacquaint with you today, my friend.

Governor McGreevey: Hey, Harry, They won’t say such nice words at my funeral mass. So…

Harry Hurley: Well, it put me on the list and I’ll make sure I know. You’re going to be here longer than all of us. So, Governor, before we get to the present, I know you’ve obviously had decades to process all this. And you waited a number of years. You waited until 2006 to write your book, The Confession, that this word cathartic, is overused. And I hate to use words that are overused in society, but was that cathartic to be able to to put down to scribe, you know, what happened, why it happened and you know how you were handling it all?

Governor McGreevey: Yeah. You know, I think, one, it’s great to be with you and and it’s good to have, you know, a first class Irishman filling in for Guy. But I know I’ll hear about that. But no, you know, it’s just in life, I think, you know. Well, I’ll speak for myself. You know, there are many joys with your children, your family. But there are troubles and challenges. And for me and I try not to make this, you know, it’s just a fact of who I was. I you know, in that speech, I said I was a gay American. And that’s something that I knew when I was like six years old on the playground. But at the time, it was a very different America. And, you know, I grew up in a great home loving parents, supportive, engaging. But it’s, you know, being gay wasn’t something that you saw. You didn’t see it in the in on television. You didn’t see it in the newspapers and you saw it or you understood it as something, you know, wickedly immoral or, you know, wrong. And so it’s something that you at least for me. And there were other people that candidly that were braver and more decent. I tried to run away from. And so it’s a part of who I am. It’s clearly not the only measure of me. And, you know, I was in I was I was married and got involved in a wrongful affair, which clearly was was wrong and not appropriate. And so as my as my grandmother would say, God works in mysterious ways because after the resignation, you know, the ability to go to seminary, we say, you know, what is what is the disgraced politician should do? And, you know, after they resign, then they go get God as opposed to getting God and then doing the right thing. But, you know, being in seminary, one of the great joys, the dean of the seminary sent me up to Harlem to a place called Exodus Transitional Ministry. And I had always been interested in as mayor of Woodbridge Runaway State Prison within my backyard. It’s a it’s a tough place, probably the first or second toughest day prison in the state of New Jersey. And it’s where the lifers were. These were guys that were convicted for life and serve until their last breathing. Our minute, their lives behind the wall. And there was a group called the Lifers Group where you bring young guys that you know may have been caught involvement to try to listen to older, wiser men say, look, you know, make the right decision. But, you know, I had been involved since gently, gently butchering the word. But and so basically what happened is in the seminar, I went up and worked and Exodus, and it was transforming because I realized that those persons wanted what we all wanted. They wanted three square meals a day. They wanted a cot and a pillow to put their head down. They wanted to love their family and they wanted a job, a purpose. And it was literally at seminary. And I’ll always be grateful to Father four for saying, Jim, you need to go up there, because he saw that, you know, that I needed to redefine my life. He saw that, you know, whatever skills that I had, I could help folks coming back from things or state prison or federal prison. And, you know, it was just so many miracles. I mean, just understanding these guys that had come back and candidly, the prison system doesn’t encourage you to think on your feet. I saw guys that were built and clearly spent a lot of time in the gym, but they couldn’t pick up the phone to dial for a G.E.D. because, you know, prison doesn’t encourage you to think for yourself. It’s about following orders, which has its place. But ultimately, when you come out and 95 to 97% of guys and gals are going to come out, it’s then just very difficult to get on your feet and to do the next great thing, right.

Harry Hurley: Nothing was done to prepare you to come back into society and be productive. I’ve got to ask you one last question, because we’ve never had a chance to talk about this on air. What was that like when you resigned your position? I know I you know, I was your friend. I am your friend. I’ve always been your friend. Always proud to be your friend. That doesn’t all that does not matter to me. But I can only imagine how painful that was. You worked for so many years. You one. You became the governor, the most powerful governor position in America, the most densely populated state. You ran, you won, and then you had to give it up. That had to be painful.

Governor McGreevey: You know, it was hard, but at the moment. And they say this in the rooms and you say this in recovery when you know there’s an old expression, the breaks in the vase, in the vase, is where God’s grace comes through. And when you’re at that point. And that they never share this publicly. My grandmother, God rest his soul, would always wear the green scapular. And I hadn’t seen this. My grandmother had died years and years before. And for whatever reason it was, it was just a freak circumstance. I opened up the drawer as I had had day after day after day, and it was my grandmother’s scapular. And when, you know, we’re an Irish family and when I was a kid, my grandmother would always put it on the corner of her bed. And I just literally prayed to my grandmother. I said, you know, let me do the right thing. And at that point in time, I believe in my heart and I still believe that the right thing was to resign. And it was, you know, in one sense, it was very liberating for me, but it was also painful for my wife. It was as it painful for her family. It was painful for not so much for my mom. Mothers always forget that.

Harry Hurley: They just love you unconditionally.

Governor McGreevey: Yeah. And but and and as does my father. But, you know, he was old school. United States Marine Corps D. A you know, and it was, you know, but I’m sure my father was there and I’m sure and he since passed on. I’m sure he would rather have been any other place in the world. Yeah, but his love for his son and my mom put put them there. As with dinner, my wife, the mother of my daughter, Jacqueline. And so, you know, at the end of the day, when you’re going through a rough patch, it’s something to have people stand by you whose love for you, you know, overcomes, you know, whatever, whatever you’re putting them through. So, yeah, it was on one hand, it was liberating to me. Hopefully I did what was ethically and morally the right thing. I’m pretty sure I did, most importantly for, you know, the state of my family. And but obviously, it was painful for the people closest to me. And for that, you know, you have to atone and try to do better.

Harry Hurley: And in America 2023, you would not even have had to resign. It would not even be on the radar screen of disqualifying or anything. Even, you know, people back then argued back and forth, hey, “is that what’s he have to resign for because he loved someone?” So let me let me move on. I talked earlier when I was introducing you to guys audience for the couple of minutes right before our time together, where if you’re just tuning into the Guy Benson Show, we are visiting with a very good friend of mine, the former governor of New Jersey, Governor Jim McGreevey, the 52nd governor of the state of New Jersey. And I imagine that you are literally a story of many victories, many victories. As mayor of Woodbridge Township, you served over ten years. That’s a minimum of two or three elections and wins right there. You won the New Jersey assembly seat. You won the New Jersey Senate seat. You won governor, and then the fall. Then what I believe is the redemption. But I mean that in the best way, not in a hokey way and now possibly a political electoral comeback. I wrote a column a week or two back where there is a very consequential big New Jersey City, appropriately named Jersey City. And there is definitely going to be a new mayor in the not too distant future because the current mayor, Steve Fulop, who’s also been a longtime mayor of Jersey City, is running for governor. He will not be running. You cannot run. You run in one. You used to be able to hold two seats. And if you’re not grandfathered, you can’t do it. So he has to give up. Mayor, that seat is going to be open. He is my friend, my friend of almost 30 years, Jim McGreevey, going to be a candidate for mayor of Jersey City? Make make my day, Governor, Governor, make my day. Give us breaking news on the Guy Benson Show. Is it it true?

Governor McGreevey: Well, you know, it’s something that I’m going to decide by the end of this summer, but it’s something that that really appeals to me. I mean, blowing my my dear friend Brian Stack, Senator Stack, who’s the mayor of a huge city, encouraged me to do it. And, you know, Jersey City is a pretty special place. It’s it’s it’s where all the so many immigrants have come through this country, whether through Ellis Island or through Newark Airport. And it’s arguably one of the most interesting cities in America, not just New Jersey. And it’s where my you know, my grandfather was a beat cop. And where my parents grew up, where I was born. And so it’s a really special place because not only of its strategic location. We like to say that it’s on the on the on the right side of the Hudson, actually the left side. But, you know, the important point is, is that it’s a little bit of Americana. It’s about people yearning to do better, to educate their children, to have a slice of American pie. So it’s a place I really love. It’s a place that is both gritty and then, you know, you have the apartments and the buildings along the Hudson waterfront. So it’s it combines a best of both. And so after, you know, what I’ve learned is, you know, the past ten years working in reentry and trying to grind it out, whether it’s on health care or mental illness or particularly employment and training, training, employment, jobs, jobs, jobs that government can do good things. And it’s just like making the thing that’s taught me I would have not had this lesson had I not been doing what I’ve been doing for ten years. And I know final minute.

Harry Hurley: I don’t want to say this, governor, but final minute with regrets. But you and I are gonna spend a lot of time on air together. And when you’re Jersey City mayor, I’m going to still call you governor. That’s just, you know, it’s just the way that that I do things. I think you’re going to run. And I think the only way you’re not the next mayor of Jersey City is if you don’t run.

Governor McGreevey: Well, thank you, Harold. And I just, I’m grateful for your friendship and who you are and your integrity. And at the end of the day, your friendship is is what counts. So thank you.

Harry Hurley: Before we say goodbye, is it more likely than unlikely that you will be running?

Governor McGreevey: I would say more likely.

Harry Hurley: Governor, that was more than I could ask, because I know, you know, you do a lot of deliberating and timing. And when you want to declare, if you’re going to.

Governor McGreevey: Declare to get the girl’s approval and I’m 90% there.

Harry Hurley: All right, Governor, let’s stay close.

Governor McGreevey: All right, brother. Thanks.

Harry Hurley: Good to be with you.