Jul 11, 2012
Print This Post
A set of standards that will determine what Nebraska school children will learn about American history is causing controversy after an initial draft left out the Founding Fathers – and another promoted cultural equivalency over American exceptionalism.
The debate focuses on drafts of Nebraska’s social studies standards. Every school district in the state must adopt the standards or enact their own of equal or greater rigor, Omaha.com reported.
FOLLOW TODD ON FACEBOOK FOR DAILY CULTURE WAR STORIES!! CLICK HERE.
An early draft has already been rewritten after it excluded George Washington and Benjamin Franklin – along with other Founding Fathers and historical dates.
And while Nebraska Board of Education member John Sieler is glad to see the Founding Fathers restored to the standards, he said there are other serious problems. He said the standards teach global warming as fact, promote cultural equivalency and fail to promote American exceptionalism.
DISCOVER WHY SARAH PALIN LOVES TODD’S NEW BOOK – CLICK HERE!
“We need to specifically reject this concept that all ideas are equal or all cultures are equal,” Sieler told Fox News Radio. “All cultures are not equal. All ideas are not equal and we need to state that in a positive manner instead of glossing over this and having some ‘Kumbaya let’s all get along, everybody’s wonderful’ feeling.”
Sieler said he’s received at least 30 emails from constituents who are upset that the draft process was not open to the public. Among the chiefs concers — no mention of American exceptionalism.
“I strongly believe in American exceptionalism,” he said.
Instead the draft instructs schools to make sure high school students can “analyze and evaluate the impact of people, events and symbols upon history in the United States and abroad,” Omaha.com reported. It also called on students to explore history from multiple perspectives.
Sieler said the state needs to adopt a specific statement recognizing American exceptionalism.
“That is the key to the whole thing,” he said. “We need to teach that we are the good guys. That doesn’t mean we have to hide some of the things that we are not proud of as a nation. We’ve made some mistakes but we are on the right course. We’re not out to conquer countries and enslave people.”
Donlynn Rice, the state’s administrator of curriculum, instruction and innovation, stressed that the draft is “not a completed document.”
“Certainly the standards are very strong in the fact that America is a great country,” she told Fox News Radio. “What exact terms we use remains to be seen as we work with the draft.”
Rice said she was not sure if the term “American exceptionalism” is in the draft.
“We’re talking about the importance of understanding different cultures,” she said. “We certainly want students to be aware there are many different cultures both in our country and across the world.”
Rice said they are listening to public input and used the re-inclusion of the historical figures to illustrate that point.
“It was a bit premature for people to get so concerned that they weren’t going to be there when in fact they were looking at a very, very early draft of the standards,” she said.
Sieler also expressed concern about how capitalism and free market enterprise are conveyed in the standards.
“We need to say free market enterprise is good,” he said. “Socialism is bad. To me, it’s black and white.
He also said the standards teach global warming as fact instead of a theory and incorrectly used the terms democracy and republic.
“We are a representative government,” he said. “We don’t have direct democracy and there’s a big difference.”
Sieler also said the standards promoting “global government.”
“The U.S. Constitution does not recognize a global government,” he said. “We recognize the government of the United States.”
Rice said the standards are meant to focus on what students should know and be able to do.
“We don’t teach beliefs in our standards,” she said. ‘We teach the content, knowledge and the skills.”
But Sieler said it’s necessary to know and learn some facts before you can talk about concepts.
“How can you discuss something like the Civil War if you don’t know who Abraham Lincoln is?” he wondered.
Rice said the draft will be in development for several more months – and welcomed the heated discussions on the document.
“I think it’s wonderful that people are interested,” she said. “Of all the content areas, social studies is citizenship in action. Social studies is about our history and our government. It’s really an area we live every day. The fact that people are interested and people are passionate is a great thing.”
Sieler said he worries that political correctness might be behind some of the controversy.
“The other side would say I’m being conservatively correct or whatever,” he said. “Maybe I am. But I think we need to teach the right standards.”
Related posts:
FOX News Talk
What is sad to me is that people think that this is ok… There is nothing more amazing than the sacrificial actions of our founding fathers and how our country was formed. This is also why I invest in older history books that are" pre" political correctness..
When this is accepted,then the Nation is gone.Americans helped the planet,not the Nazi's,and others that wanted to enslave it.Americans ended slavery in the USA with an Amendment,helped to end 2 world wars,gave money and lives to end tyranny,but the indoctrinators of the young are ignorant to the facts.
David Burleson also: fabricated and waged wars of aggression for territory against Mexico and Spain, broke countless treaties and practically committed genocide and forced relocation of American Indians, supported the rise of dictators over democratically elected governments in Chile, Indonesia and Iran, maintained slavery in the USA for a century, and currently is the largest arms dealer in the world. your kind love to wave your flags and plug your fingers in your ears singing "na na na", but part of being a great country would be to not bury our mistakes and atrocities. tell the children the truth so they can improve us!
You should be ashamed to live in this infamous nation. Why dont you move to a more reputable country before you look like a hypocrite? I wouldnt want your reputation as a week minded elitist apologizer to be tainted!
Meh, if it weren't Europeans, it would have been the Chinese. The lesson of the Native American story is that you can't hang out in the Stone Age when other people are making ships and working steel. Every human being on this planet alive today ( including YOU Ian Kaser ) are the direct beneficiaries of every war, rape, conquest and theft that has happened in the history of mankind. History's losers are all DEAD. If you want to feel guilt and hate your country, well I suppose that's your problem. I don't think we should be teaching guilt to children for things they had nothing to do with.
Meh, if it weren't Europeans, it would have been the Chinese. The lesson of the Native American story is that you can't hang out in the Stone Age when other people are making ships and working steel. Every human being on this planet alive today ( including YOU Ian Kaser ) are the direct beneficiaries of every war, rape, conquest and theft that has happened in the history of mankind. History's losers are all DEAD. If you want to feel guilt and hate your country, well I suppose that's your problem. I don't think we should be teaching guilt to children for things they had nothing to do with.
Ian is dead right. The US is up there with the Stalin, Mao, Hitler, and Pol Pot in terms of crimes against humanity.
I mean seriously – we committed mass slavery, genocide against Indians… That amount of evil is enough for me. I'd move to another country – but they are all just as evil as we are.
There is no exceptionalism – all countries have a moral equivilency – they are equally evil.
Amazing and true statement. People need to wake up and see what the government of the USA is and how it treats the world. In the 30s and 40s a country thought it was the best and unstoppable. They tried to dictate a lot of things, rewritting history, extreme nationalsim, etc. They were called Nazis, what do we call america?
Rolo Tomassi why dont you try out another county for awhile. You will see that the freedom to ANYTHING is nonexistent. You are the reason we have weak public schools, ashamed of a nation that provides you with the ability to say idiotic comments that you produce every time you fart.
While the things you say about our past may be true, do not also forget that we improved the entire world by our inventions and discoveries in medicine and science, trade, ideals and spending our treasure and blood in helping others. The world is a much better place because of this idea put forth by our founding fathers. Instead of listening to the drivel of the elites in your universities, do some readings of this great nation, formed by the refuge of other nations where people were united by an idea and let this nation to go from a raw land to putting man on the moon in only 200 years. Never has this world seen a more educated, fair, kind and giving nation. I run into many young people with some college who think they know it all and beat themself because they are American. I have lived and travelled through 40 other nations in my life-thank the lord almighty that you were born American. Don't believe me? Get out and travel through other nations.
FYI, Mexico attached the US before the Mexican American war. (yes look it up) Liberals always like to attack the US basedon on old precieved wrong doing. Name one culture or group of people that hasn't been enslaved or done the enslaving. Name one group or country that hasn't been in a war or committed an attrocity. You can't because its in everyones history not just ours. Now name the countries and people that have saved lives ended wars cured deseases removed tyrants. Oh there is only one The US. get a clue.
Devon Black the wiping out of the Indians came mostly from desease. The bubonic plauge, black death, that wiped out half of Europe came from somewhere else. Do you blame China and Africa for the death of millions? No you don't ? If you don't then you can hardly blame the English for the death of millions of Indians.
Ian you should read the book Guns, Germs and Steel so you have a more accurate view of the history of the decline of Native Americans. While Americans did relocate and participate in a small number of massecres, like the "Sand Creek Massecre," the majority of Native American deaths were caused by their lack of resistance to germs like smallpox and influenza. Also, many of our actions establishing dictators took place to stop the spread of communism, which many of our leaders at that time saw as a threat to our existence. I imagine many of the choice we made where not exactly what our country wanted, but the lesser of two evils.
Ian,you are free to never be in the USA,and you need to get your history lessons fro ma betterplace than you did.You are wrong in too many parts to list,the Mexican army invading Texas as only one part.Now run along,your short bus will miss you again if yo uare late.
Devon Black slavery is still ongoing,and the USA is against it,so keep your bs kid.
IAN,, seems like a low life like you would feel more at home in any one of those countries you mention.
Wait for the weekend, we'll help you pack
BJ, sarcasm…Sarcasm. I loved the CONSTITUTION, all the way up until Obama used it for toilet paper.
so much mad. jesus people.. learn the real history… not the glenn beck / 4th grade history
oh and where did i say i hated america? where did i deem any nation its superior? such a typical attitude. WELL CHINA KILLED PEOPLE! WELL EVERYONE DOES THAT! WELL THE NAZIS! is that what were satisfied with? being a little better than the nazis? christ. we should be trying to improve ourselves. not sugar-coat our past.
I used to watch Keith Olberman who says he hates "rich old white men". But hes off the air now cuz he didnt like the limo drivers current gave him…
Rolo Tomassi the fact that you watch tv says it all
OH I LOVE HISTORY! Lets talk about Barry Obama's mom and the LITERALLY communist black guys she gang banged. THEN ran off to the phillipines with some MUSLIM guy who taught Obama how to properly grill the family dog. THEN dumped the bastard child off with her grandparents. Typical apple pie american story right?
I didnt say you hate america. I say you hate the constitution. Its a stumbling block to a controlled society which you think youll get first class status when its implemented cuz your "one of them". Just ask Stalin what he did with the original bulsheviks from the revolution.
Ian Kaser You lack the knowledge about real history,you lack intelligence,and you are not worth my time.
Its funny how someone changes their mind once their comment gets shot at.
Mendocino, that's kalifornia right? Can't expect or get much from the land of fruits and nuts!
Ian Kaser Glenn Beck is a true American Patriot. Not many of us left as you so tellingly show us. God blessed the America we used to be and will bless the America we can be again but there is a lot of work we must do to revitalize the BEST COUNTRY ON EARTH. We never had to apologize before obama but now we certainly do for not having the intelligence to see through the hype his hope and change marxism represents. God is very angry with us but we can begin to redeem ourselves by getting rid of obama and his ilk and reaffirming our belief in good moral values and the EXCEPTIONALISM of America. GOD bless America again PLEASE.
Ian Kaser Glenn Beck is a true American Patriot. Not many of us left as you so tellingly show us. God blessed the America we used to be and will bless the America we can be again but there is a lot of work we must do to revitalize the BEST COUNTRY ON EARTH. We never had to apologize before obama but now we certainly do for not having the intelligence to see through the hype his hope and change marxism represents. God is very angry with us but we can begin to redeem ourselves by getting rid of obama and his ilk and reaffirming our belief in good moral values and the EXCEPTIONALISM of America. GOD bless America again PLEASE.
Ronald Gonyea Nutburger,I use to live there,so your point is what,besides the end of your tin foil hat? nothing.California has no K in it,but,you are not intelligent,so you can not understand it. Ian is an idiot,and you did make good points against Ian, but you screwed up by making bs claims against me.
Not even close fool.
Another little lesson from history : its hard to assert a land claim when you can't draw a map.
I would have expected to read this article about Connecticut or New York, not Nebraska, for crying out loud!
I would have expected to read this article about Connecticut or New York, not Nebraska, for crying out loud!
Most people haven't a clue what "American exceptionalism" means. It was a term used by Alex de Tocqueville in Democracy in America. It refers to the fact that this country was unlike all others in the sense that it was settled by a more or less homogenous people sharing the same general cultural, moral, and historical backgrounds, in a new nation that had not come about as a result of wars and centuries of cross cultural blending that resulted from wars and kings. It really had little to do with the citizens being "better" than others.
There is more to the notion than homogeneity
American exceptionalism is the theory that the United States is different from other countries in that it has a specific world mission to spread liberty and democracy. In this view, America's exceptionalism stems from its emergence from a revolution, becoming "the first new nation," and developing a uniquely American ideology, based on liberty, egalitarianism, individualism, populism and laissez-faire. This observation can be traced to Alexis de Tocqueville, the first writer to describe the United States as "exceptional" in 1831 and 1840. Historian Gordon Wood has argued, "Our beliefs in liberty, equality, constitutionalism, and the well-being of ordinary people came out of the Revolutionary era. So too did our idea that we Americans are a special people with a special destiny to lead the world toward liberty and democracy."
I thought American Exceptionalism was the mistaken notion that the lessons of history, economics and warfare do not apply to us. I figured it was a tool used by those who would promote an agenda by trying to divorce logical outcomes from policy decisions.
I guess you were wrong then.
Doris Oberlander All you did was cut and paste Wikipedia's definition of American Exceptionalism you plagiarist. I guess citing sources is something else school's need to teach.
This is a comment section not a journal research paper silly.
This is a comment section not a journal research paper silly.
Doris, you are a fool if you think America is Exceptional in the sense that Americans ( and various politicians ) cannot successfully wreck it.
Hear! Hear! Wesley!
Where oh where did you come up with the idea that I think America can not be wrecked. Did you just make it up out of thin air?
Doris, wish I had seen your post earlier. I reread "Democracy in America" every few years and am increasingly chilled by de Tocqueville's understanding of the inherent threats. His description of the US being reduced to the lowest common denominator has never been more true.
Doris, by trashing my comment it follows that you believe to the contrary, does it not? Or do you want to back up now and say American Exceptionalism can mean more than one thing. Invalidate your first retort or the second, your choice.
LOL wow your logic is just too funny. Try to make sense. Your silly assumption is that American Exceptionalism has any thing to do with twisted politicians. Any idea can be abused, it has nothing to do with the truth of the original idea. You are wrong still, because you assert that exceptionalism is the "mistaken notion that the lessons of history, economics and warfare".
On the contrary, maybe you should have read the SECOND paragraph of the very Wikipedia link you copy-and-pasted from that says "Although the term does not necessarily imply superiority, many neoconservative and American conservative writers have promoted its use in that sense.[1][6] To them, the United States is like the biblical "shining city on a hill," and exempt from historical forces that have affected other countries.[" So let me explain it to you like this : #1 there is more than interpretation, #2 you are wrong, and #3 well, you probably got the email notification with my original comment.
Most people haven't a clue what "American exceptionalism" means. It was a term used by Alex de Tocqueville in Democracy in America. It refers to the fact that this country was unlike all others in the sense that it was settled by a more or less homogenous people sharing the same general cultural, moral, and historical backgrounds, in a new nation that had not come about as a result of wars and centuries of cross cultural blending that resulted from wars and kings. It really had little to do with the citizens being "better" than others.
Indoctrination and dumbing down goes hand in hand in the 21st century.
You are a great example of it.
Jay Shepherd Apparently you are an example of non-exceptional-ism? Because Joe is a trooper for American values. I think perhaps we should just give Nebraska to Canada eh?
The Liberals just want to live in a Utopia that will never happen. What might happen though, is that they turn America into bowl of Jello unable to defend itself because of some misplaced belief in cultural conformity to YOUR idea of a perfect world.
Sorry, but not everyone believes that the world can live in peace. In fact, it has been proven time and again that humans don't want peace, they want pieces!!!!!
Jay Shepherd
Ahh, indoctrinated and dumbed down speaks. Wow, I just made a factual comment and you come out of the woodwork. Hmm, must have struck a nerve sweetheart. Now how about a pic, that way we have an example of the true face of indoctrination and dumbing down in America. Geesh, people like you never cease to amaze.
You prove my point.
You prove my point.
Jay Shephard
Survey says,,,XXX
Try again faceless boy blunder.
Factual? There were no facts.
Jeff Scheidal
Jeff Scheidel
Jeff Scheidel.
Wow. Now THAT'S a stupid comment if I've ever seen one. Even amongst the idiot fox "news" viewers!
LOL!
As a Nebraskan, I am so saddened to see this. As a Father, sign me up for the next debate!
Uuugghhh… Why does my city only show up in the news when we do something retarded. I think we need to face it. This state was once a conservative, respectable place. Is this still the case? I don't know.
Uuugghhh… Why does my city only show up in the news when we do something retarded. I think we need to face it. This state was once a conservative, respectable place. Is this still the case? I don't know.
go big red
Let your voice be heard Drew! The constituents of the state need to tell the Board what THEY want in their curriculum!!
good bye America…..Flush!@.
we deserve what we get for putting liberals incharge of everything.
wake up dumb a@@es before your country is gone.
Our country is already gone. it was outsourced and sold piecemeal to corporations and foreign countries by conservatives only interested in making themselves rich.
Charlez Kenshol You can put some of this blame back on the unions in this country who forced companies to look overseas for cheaper labor. Both sides bear responsibility for this one.
I dislike Unions almost as much as I dislike corporate "entities". However, I can not fully agre with you on quite how much responsibility unions must bear for this. I've worked for several jobs that were outsourced, and I've never worked for a union. Sure, a union may have demanded better pay and benefits for the employees, but that does not necessarily mean that they "forced" companies to look overseas for cheaper labour. It's not quite the unions fault that companies want to spend as little in labour and overhead as possible.
Charlez Kenshol , it would be nice if you posted something intelligent.
Ole Charlie—-you are one desperate, lying and pathetic lefty—-please grow up and start to handle the truth—–
Why is it you think only conservatives want to get rich? George Soros and his ilk aren't conservative and they are the richest people in the world. What's wrong with making money anyway? You people are amazing. Do you always want to live from crust to crust with no anticipation of ever improving your life? You can do that in a socialist country, where the government doles out what it thinks everyone deserves. Here we like to think we can earn it for ourselves. The harder you work the more money you can make until, maybe one day, you too are a millionaire. If you don't like our lifestyle go live in China or North Korea or Iran.
The union vs. management fight has been going on for 100 years. It works out to even the playing field. When the massive government regulation and environmental requirements get thrown onto the management side of the equation, it them makes it impossible to hire U.S. workers. Hence, China’s success.
Susan Cox- once upon a time, corporations saw themselves as being part of a community, and often they were, that's why there were" company towns." The management class, in those bygone times had a sense of fairness; in that they saw the value that veteran workers added and compensated them accordingly, and made it possible to raise a family on those wages. Today that is gone, if a factory could get away with paying people $3/hr they would, and they have a big party at every stockholders meeting. Unions are not fundamentally bad, yes there are some bad eggs, but they came about because workers were tired of seeing the value of the company and the prices of the products they made increase and never saw a cent of it. Unions aren't perfect, but without the the bluecollar worker doesn't stand a chance.
If you actually knew your real history, you wouldn't be saying this. You are obviously a product of our Politically Correct education system. If you have a job, I'm guessing someone is paying you, and you gladly accept that paycheck. Corporations, like churches, are made up of imperfect humans, but for the most part, they support this population. Regulation is what forced companies to outsource, and even though many have, there are just as many who haven't. Unions served a purpose in their day, but fair labor standards laws take care of those issues not. Public unions are now a horrible drain on the economy of many states.
Yet I bet you continue to write your rants on a PC or laptop made by a corporation, ignoring the fact that most of the prospaerity we have now, was made possible by corporations.
Yet I bet you continue to write your rants on a PC or laptop made by a corporation, ignoring the fact that most of the prospaerity we have now, was made possible by corporations.
Charlez Kenshol
It wasn't just Conservatives! President Obama also sold us out. Billions of dollars was handed out to China and India. The new GM plant wasn't built in America, but in China! The money used to pay for it was given out by this current administration! OUR MONEY!
The unions are run by some of the dumbest laziest, most uneducated con-artists on the planet! Who needs Middle Eastern Terrorists when we have the corrupt AFL-CIO! The unions will kiss the ass of any idiot like Obama and his band of criminals. Yes I called them terrorists and criminals! I STAND BY IT!
Business mostly outsource for one main reason: MONEY! IF THE TAXES ARE TOO HIGH…THE EMPLOYER MOVES HIS/HER BUSINESS. I am sure you would do the same. Like it or not business is about making money and if the cost of doing business is cheaper somewhere else you move. Pure and simple. You don't need an econ degree to figure this out. You want more jobs lower taxes and tell congress to stop wasting money on crap like NPR. Yes NPR could make their own money it's called advertising and private companies do it everyday. The public school system also needs to stand on it's own 2 feet. It's that simple. Another moron run organization, the USPS is a disgrace! This moron run organization also needs to be privatized.
PERSONALLY I HAVE HAD IT WITH THESE WHINY & WUSSIE RUN COMPANIES/ORGANIZATIONS BECAUSE THERE TO DAMN LAZY TO EARN A BUCK!
I was raised to bust my ass for anything I desire. Yes it's been a real drag, but it's made me a better person, a better worker, and a better AMERICAN!
Charlez Kenshol
It wasn't just Conservatives! President Obama also sold us out. Billions of dollars was handed out to China and India. The new GM plant wasn't built in America, but in China! The money used to pay for it was given out by this current administration! OUR MONEY!
The unions are run by some of the dumbest laziest, most uneducated con-artists on the planet! Who needs Middle Eastern Terrorists when we have the corrupt AFL-CIO! The unions will kiss the ass of any idiot like Obama and his band of criminals. Yes I called them terrorists and criminals! I STAND BY IT!
Business mostly outsource for one main reason: MONEY! IF THE TAXES ARE TOO HIGH…THE EMPLOYER MOVES HIS/HER BUSINESS. I am sure you would do the same. Like it or not business is about making money and if the cost of doing business is cheaper somewhere else you move. Pure and simple. You don't need an econ degree to figure this out. You want more jobs lower taxes and tell congress to stop wasting money on crap like NPR. Yes NPR could make their own money it's called advertising and private companies do it everyday. The public school system also needs to stand on it's own 2 feet. It's that simple. Another moron run organization, the USPS is a disgrace! This moron run organization also needs to be privatized.
PERSONALLY I HAVE HAD IT WITH THESE WHINY & WUSSIE RUN COMPANIES/ORGANIZATIONS BECAUSE THERE TO DAMN LAZY TO EARN A BUCK!
I was raised to bust my ass for anything I desire. Yes it's been a real drag, but it's made me a better person, a better worker, and a better AMERICAN!
Charlez Kenshol You will love communism with state owned business. With obama in charge we are on the way!
Charlez Kenshol You will love communism with state owned business. With obama in charge we are on the way!
Wow, how to skirt the issue. They were "forced" by economics and they "did" demand better pay & beneifits, not "may have", Charlez. I'm with Susan on this.
Charlez Kenshol You said "It's not quite the unions fault that companies want to spend as little in labour and overhead as possible.".
It's called business 101, or Gee, I want to keep the price of the widget I'm making as low as possible to compete in the world market place. Let me see, my union workers won't settle for less than $22 an hour will full medical. I can get the same widget made in China for $4 an hour and China supplies the medical.
I recently bought a brand new tractor for our farm, I believe in buying American when possible. The last American tractor plant left the U.S. a few years ago for Mexico, Care to guess what the motivation for moving the jobs was.
I bought a bright shiny new Kubota, from Japan instead of the bright shiny green tractor from John Deere due to quality price considerations. If, if the unions had not forced John Deere out of the U.S. I would have had their tractor.
Steve Yeoman,
The CEO of ford makes more in a year than the top 5 executives of the top 5 Japanese auto companies COMBINED. Do some research and find out how much a Kubota assembly factory worker makes relative to the CEO of Kubota. If it's anything like the automotive industry you'll see where the money is really going. The fact is, the US overpays it's management class almost to the point of being disgusting. You have to ask yourself, why does a Wall St. guy, who only makes bets on the rise or fall of the percieved value of a company (i.e. the stock market) deserve to make millions and the guy who has a hand in actually creating the product that makes it to the shelf at the store make 35K? The manufacturer can exist without wall st. Wall st. cannot exist without the manufacturer. Don't you think there's a better way to slice up the pie? I'm not avocating communism, just a kind of gruff honesty and sence of dignity that should make you want to pay your workers according to their value, and not try to get away with paying the absolute least possible.
22/hr is 45k a year
18/hr is 37k a year
15/hr is 31k a year
Tell me how much should a factory worker make? bare in mind if they can't live off it, what's the point?
btw
The union didn't force JD to move to mexico, the US workers just cut into the bottom line too much- and lests face it, when you make your products in Mexico, it doesn't matter where your headquartered; you're a Mexican company.
No but it does have something to do with the regulations the federal government puts on businesses.
Charles, you don't need to have unions in your company to feel their influence. Unions are a product of Marxist ideology and have forced increased costs of doing buisness on ALL companies in ALL states, even the right to work ones. Your dislike of corporate "entities" as you put it is misplaced due to a life long liberal indoctrination whether you realize it or not. Corporations are people, more so than unions. Unions are parasites. They and democrats deserve the lion's share of blame for America's problems.
Charlez Kenshol Thats a fucking lie,You are the typical LIBERAL .
No facts or truths will change you, typical progressive anti-american traiter.
And how do i know, Because you dont have the balls to show your face .
LOL clown with a katana.
Someday some patriot is going to shove that blade up your worthless ass.
Wow Steve, how more wrong can you be. the point you are missing in your "its not fair" rant is that…wait for it…LIFE IS NOT ABOUT BEING FAIR!!!!!!!!!!!! when are you leftists going to ever get it, the guy that makes the product can always stop that and go work on wall street. stop blaming rich people for being successfull. ofcourse what could anyone expect from Steve. He lives in NYC and studied the arts. yea thats really worth something. go sit in your mom's basement and do more thinking about things. thats about all your degree is worth.
Just a note. GE outsourced more jobs than most other companies in the U.S. and the CEO of GE is a Democrat in fact he works for Obama in the White House. We need to stop blaming one side or the other. Both sides corporations and politicians alike are to blame.
Steve Yeomans, you are ignorant or a liar, or both, but John Deere STILL builds tractors, of all sizes in the US of A. How do I know? Well, I drive by their FACTORY every day on my way to work. The same FACTORY that employs some 5k+ workers of salary and wage (union) members. They have FACTORIES in Davenport, Iowa, Waterloo, Iowa, and Des Moines, Iowa. They also have facilities in Georgia, Texas, Wisconsin and Colorado. Last time I checked,ALL those locations were still in the US.
So what's your REAL reason for going with a Kubota???
Steve Yeomans, you are ignorant or a liar, or both, but John Deere STILL builds tractors, of all sizes in the US of A. How do I know? Well, I drive by their FACTORY every day on my way to work. The same FACTORY that employs some 5k+ workers of salary and wage (union) members. They have FACTORIES in Davenport, Iowa, Waterloo, Iowa, and Des Moines, Iowa. They also have facilities in Georgia, Texas, Wisconsin and Colorado. Last time I checked,ALL those locations were still in the US.
So what's your REAL reason for going with a Kubota???
I've held several union jobs in my 57 years, and will never, repeat, NEVER belong to another union. Not only that, I'll cross a picket line in a HEARTBEAT. Unions used to be good, but today they are no more than socialist, greedy shills, interested only in what they can take, and to Hell with everyone else.
As to your comments about "conservatives", just look to the ten most wealthy U. S. senators: nine of them are leftwing, "liberal" democrats, who seem to think that, like most other areas, capitalismm is good for their wallet, but not mine. And we fools tolerate this sh*t, AND pay their salaries.
The Audacity of Rope!
Ian Novick then start a good company you greedy little communist…
You are not American. Surely I'm not the only one who picked up on this. His English and the way he spelled "labor". Also "It's not quite the unions fault?". He didn't spell labor correct again for someone in the US and his grammar is very good for someone who is not American! I should know….I have worked with Brits, Australians, and New Zealanders! Also, piecemeal in his first post? Try again! I think you are an Aussie because all the slang you have used is from there.
My response is to Charlez Kenshol.
You don't understand economics if you still think that outsourcing manufacturing jobs is something done purely out of selfish greed. First, Americans don't want to perform many the jobs being outsourced, and for pay that can be offered; for example, mushroom growers in the US can't find people who want to tend to and harvest the mushrooms. This is just one of the menial tasks that people don't like to do. Second, the American economy has grown out of manufacturing. Most manufacturing is something that is base, repetitive, and in no way leads to direct advances. There are some exceptions. The process to transform to a tech and service economy from industrial has been painful, that is true. People who've held jobs for years can't retrain, and it is difficult to watch people struggle financially. This is where corporations could have done better; they should have made the transition smoother and not left people hanging. The outsourcing is not the problem, it was the manner how it was done. Corporations should have actively helped people find new jobs, and given them a temporary or partial income that ramped up with age, to compensate for workers inability to learn new skills.
Charlez Kenshol I would look to these so-called "free trade" agreements foisted on us by both political parties that put American workers in DIRECT competition with oversees workers making $2 a day (slave labor as is sometimes the case in the case of China). The pols try to justify the agreements with the argument that we can sell our goods in greater quantity overseas to people who make subsistance wages! And more and more corporations exercise their fiduciary duty to max profits by outsourcing and you get, naturally enough, the gutting of America.
Rolo,
not like some kid who only has a high school education.
Technically I have; I'm self employed
Then you should hate Bill Clinton, as he is the one that got NAFTA passed and started all the job outsourcing.
Greg Sonnier An economics lesson would help but would not be enough for you, but I'll go with helping you. You need it. It's a complex world too complex for your mind. That much is obvious. but then again you are from the soundbite generation.
There is American History and World History. The topics covered should be very different, but that seems to have eluded the educators creating the American History curriculum.
Actually, from what I saw in the article, this is not about actual US/World history classes. This is about SOCIAL STUDIES, you know, the study of how society works. There's a big difference. And even if it WAS history class, I'd rather our youth be taught facts and lessons about what actually happened in the History of the world, not be brainwashed that they are somehow better than others because of where they were born.
Charles, you are a left winger that is brain washed, for you information if you can process it this country is exception, only people like you think not, so sad.
America seems to be facing a pivotal moment: Do we move ahead by advancing or by receding—by reaffirming the values that made us exceptional or by letting go of those values, so that the creeping mediocrity of Socialism begins to spare us the burdens of greatness?
Yes, there is a huge difference between Social Studies and or Civics classes and history. The article alludes to History as in 'what is being proposed to teach regarding historical figures' which of course has NOTHING to do with civics. Again, sorry Charlie, no amount of secular progressive spin or revisionist history will support your position or that of Donlynn Rice; the liberal ideologue quoted several times in the article. What she and those of her ilk continue to try to do to our children is evidently what has happened during your "education" and must stop. Since contrary to what the msm tells everyone, this remains a center-right country and the electorate is waking up to this nonsense.
Yes, there is a huge difference between Social Studies and or Civics classes and history. The article alludes to History as in 'what is being proposed to teach regarding historical figures' which of course has NOTHING to do with civics. Again, sorry Charlie, no amount of secular progressive spin or revisionist history will support your position or that of Donlynn Rice; the liberal ideologue quoted several times in the article. What she and those of her ilk continue to try to do to our children is evidently what has happened during your "education" and must stop. Since contrary to what the msm tells everyone, this remains a center-right country and the electorate is waking up to this nonsense.
Anthony, don't bother to try to reason with Charlez Kenshol; he spells color, colour and labor, labour obviously not educated in The U.S. and has no idea what the term American Exceptionalism refers to…he is obviously harboring feelings of jealously, anger or guilt.
lol.. i thought he was spelling that way simply because he's a pretentious ass.
End this type of treason now. Expose those who attempt to hurt America for what they really are. Call them out and let them know that we won't take it anymore. In Canada, years ago, we allowed this crap into our system and it has corrupted our very core. End it!
How sad to see a Midwestern state lose the concept of who we are, how we got here and what it means to be an american. Look to the left and right coasts of our country and you see where this comes from, bowing to every tin pot dictator or leader, apologizing American being a leader, a light for the rest of the world to hope to be. Strike that, we're just a bunch of average world inhabitors who offer nothing unique or exceptional. Ronald Reagan is shedding a tear right about now.
Ronald Reagan is not shedding a tear right now… you can't cry in Hell.
Charlez Kenshol , I knew you were a sick bastard!
A deeply asinine statement.
Thanks Charlez, for clearing that up for us. You can go back now.
Charlez Kenshol
"You can't cry in hell."
Chuck, why dont you go on down there and find out, because I guarantee you that you'll be crying like a Sissy La-La.
Charlez Kenshol what a douche
Steve Patterson what a douche
It may be much like Texas. Lots of people from other states have moved here to survive, then want Texas to change and be like the states they fled.
And Charlez, you are a typical liberal "progressive": unable to have a civil discussion on any subject without namecalling or dragging the discussion to the "pits".
YOU prove stupidity is alive and well
Linda Grice Burleson Good post. Kalifornia is doing that to Colorado. It is becoming the new liberal sewer
Charlez Kenshol You prove stupidity is alive and well. No one is listening just laughing at you.
Hey Charlez, I see by your profile pic that you just turn your back on society. If this country as bad as you make it out to be, why are you still living here? Move to China, Japan, France, Spain, heck Canada. Doesn't matter where, but it is obvious that the USA is not the place for you. So go, what keeps you here. Misery?
Charles, go back to your mom's basement and smoke some more cigaweed.
Judge not that you be not judged.
(Intended for Charles)
(Intended for Charles)
You are not American. Surely I'm not the only one who picked up on this. His English and the way he spelled "labor". Also "It's not quite the unions fault?". He didn't spell labor correct again for someone in the US and his grammar is very good for someone who is not American! I should know….I have worked with Brits, Australians, and New Zealanders! Also, piecemeal in his first post? Try again! I think you are an Aussie because all the slang you have used is from there.
Charlez Kenshol go back to your crack pipe, skippy.
Charlez Kenshol – Evidence of what our public schools are producing. Hateful little children that spit on the memory of the leaders of this country. I guess the liberalism that is infecting our schools is successful if we use this putz as an indicator.
Charlez Kenshol
LOL about Reagan! True. So very true.
Our boy Charles here (sorry, I'm not using the pretentious "z" he put on his name) obviously holds a great deal of hatred for this country. He reminds me of people who not only hate the country, but also their state, hometown, school and — most notably — their families.
If you talk to people like this for a few minutes, you quickly realize what they actually hate is themselves, and honestly, I pity them for the self loathing they carry around. 'nuff said.
Mike Guilmette
Make assumptions much? You know what that does…it just makes a ass out of YOU.
If you have ever read any comment "Charlz" has made on a story you would see that Mike is probably dead on with his "assumptions"
Seems to me he's dead wrong. I would assume that he's wrong about most things. But that would only be my assumption.
Charlenz – you are a troll sir. I have read all of your poor reasons for posting and it makes me laugh. I think it is time for you to go back to school and go back through US history.
Charlez, you are very mean spririted! Liberal is as liberal does!
OK, so tell me who is going to contact the fools that made this decision and demand an explanation? What possible justification could they site? What is the current opinion of the apparently apathetic parents that will be directly affected by this PC garbage? How long do we tolerate the progressive practice of adding grease to the slippery slope on which we have been subjected? What should we do NOW to reverse this 60+ year stranglehold progressive have on our educational system?
What possible justification could they site?"
What justification can we, as a society, give in teaching our children that they are humans first, americans second? American Exceptionalism (or what they are trying to make that refer to now) is the most retarded thing ever. Are you seriously saying that you want to teach yet another generation that it's ok to be an asshole to everyone else, because, 'MERIAK F**K YEAH!.
What has made America exceptional in the past has been the people. Teaching our children that they are all special snowflakes just because they were born in America is not going to actually make them exceptional at all. In fact, besides our entertainment industry, what do we really have that makes us "exceptional" compared to others in the world?
We, as Americans, are inherently no better than the Europe, than China, hell, even Africa.
Ban together and stand up against it for our kids. If people actually had the backbone we could change it. I had to stand up against a schools policy of passing a child on without learning what was required. I just told them they were not going to do that with my child. They held her back one year to give her the chance to catch up because of us moving and the next year and forward she did 100 % better. This can be done if parents take a stand and interest in their child!Did they like me to well – no – but my children learned what they were there to learn.. Read some of your kids books (what few of them they have) and sit in on a class once in awhile. It's your kids' lives at stake.
Homeschool…lots of people are doing it, and doing it well. The government is not responsible for your children's education…you are.
She needs to resign or be fired. Nebraska doesn't need ilk like her.
Are you all seriously telling me that you are upset that our youths will not be taught that they are somehow inherently better than every other countries citizens, simply because they were born in the Unites States?
“That is the key to the whole thing,” he said. “We need to teach that we are the good guys."
The only problem there is that we are NOT the good guys. Being born in the USA does not automatically make you a good person, nor does it make you better or more deserving than anyone else.
Why not actually focus our history and social studies on the people and events in history that actually ARE EXCEPTIONAL. And not just go over every little footnote in America's history with a pause at the end for smug gloating.
Evidently, you are completely confused as to the actual definition of "American Exceptionalism" – until you learn it, I suggest you refrain from posting liberal drivel.
America seems to be facing a pivotal moment: Do we move ahead by advancing or by receding—by reaffirming the values that made us exceptional or by letting go of those values, so that the creeping mediocrity of Socialism begins to spare us the burdens of greatness?
America seems to be facing a pivotal moment: Do we move ahead by advancing or by receding—by reaffirming the values that made us exceptional or by letting go of those values, so that the creeping mediocrity of Socialism begins to spare us the burdens of greatness?
So what exactly is your expert definition of "American Exceptionalism"?
Sorry Charlie, I'm not here to do your homework for you; the task is simple enough.
As in, you don't really have a good grasp on it, you just know that you don't like what I said. -20 points for you
As in, you don't really have a good grasp on it, you just know that you don't like what I said. -20 points for you
BS – you have proven over several nonsensical posts that you have no idea what you are talking about. I am simply pointing that out. Also, it is you who refuses to seek the true meaning of the term since, I now suspect, you know it will prove you are indefensibly wrong. I challenge you to learn something today…look it up.
BS – you have proven over several nonsensical posts that you have no idea what you are talking about. I am simply pointing that out. Also, it is you who refuses to seek the true meaning of the term since, I now suspect, you know it will prove you are indefensibly wrong. I challenge you to learn something today…look it up.
Anthony, don't bother to try to reason with Charlez Kenshol; he spells color, colour and labor, labour obviously not educated in The U.S. and has no idea what the term American Exceptionalism refers to…he is obviously harboring feelings of jealousy, anger or guilt.
Oh wait…he probably was educated by the same people who are rewriting the curriculum for the Nebraska school system!
and I should have said he is "harbouring" feelings ….haha
"American exceptionism", America being able to do anything it likes, despite the valid criticisms of other countries? Overthrowing democratically elecected governments because America doesn't like the people who win the election? Starting proxy wars to protect your own military and economic interests, distorting world trade to ensure America always makes a profit…….
Cheryl Ann , It appears that Charlez was educated at this fine institution of learning:http://www.miskatonic-university.org/
Mark Allen – Your interpretation is also sadly wrong but thanks for playing.
Mark Allen, aren't you Australian? Yes, why yes you are.
Mark Allen Don't confuse political action with American exceptionalism. Don't confuse Americans in general with our elected public servants in DC. Not the same thing at all. Americans do not all support our government's propensity for being meddlesome. Just be glad America IS exceptional… or you'd likely be speaking japanese right now.
All the unexceptional conservatives need SOMETHING to make them feel better about themselves!
Well if the French had faster ships, we would all be speaking French now!!
Well if the French had faster ships, we would all be speaking French now!!
Why must we continue to be subjected to pathetic non sequitur responses from people who are clueless as to the actual definition of the term "American Exceptionalism?" Hey libs, your ignorance is showing again. Please read something before you post.
Actually, all you've done is avoid answering the question.
American exceptionalism, in its modern usage, has really become nothing more than a misguided feeling of superiority. Want to know what we're superior at? Cheese production. Also oil consumption, number of nuclear reactors, miles of roadway, number of airports, corn oil production and imports of spiny-tailed lizards.
http://rankingamerica.wordpress.com/
You forgot some things. We went to Europe and helped save Britain, took France back from the Germans as well as Belgium, Austria etc. We also took back the Philipines, Solomon Islands, Papua New Guinea, East and West Malasia, Singapore, Thailand, Guam etc. We didn't occupy these countries we just gave them back and accepted "Thank you" no payment necessary. Then we helped Germany rebuild and the same in Japan. Can you name any other country in history that has done anything even close to that?
You forgot some things. We at first refused to get involved in WWII and didn't "save Britain" until it was near bombed to ruins. We can't take credit for "saving Britain", as only they can take credit for surviving Germany.
In fact, we didn't "take back" many of those exotic locales until threatened and poked with Japan's pointy stick. And I fail to see how we could give a country "back" to it's inhabitants. This is the same American revisionist history that I was hoping educational reforms such as this would address. The last thing we need is another generation like you, who seem to think that America is the "Good Guy" lead hero role in everyone's lives. Like the wars were this miserable black and white Schilnder's List reality until American came and kicked it into the colourful future. You just, as a representative of America, took credit for singlehandedly winning the entire second world war.
And as far as our "humanitarian aid" goes… Germany has paid it's fair share of reparations for that dark time, as the US did it's best to loot German occupied areas even before the war was began. We could do that because we sat out the beginning until Germany had ground itself down kicking everyone else's asses.
I meant to say that we started looting Germany before the war ENDED, and was in no way implying that was the extent of Germany's reparations.
and so much more Greg. There are many countries who have received handouts, not just from our government, but from individuals. America has always been the first to respond in disasters. Who responds if we have a disaster? We have to manage the best we can. You are extremely negative, but I'll bet you have reaped many benefits from being an American. I surely have, and I'm a 99%er, but very grateful to be an American and will not apologize to anyone for this country. You don't see people trying desparately to get into other countries any way they can.
and so much more Greg. There are many countries who have received handouts, not just from our government, but from individuals. America has always been the first to respond in disasters. Who responds if we have a disaster? We have to manage the best we can. You are extremely negative, but I'll bet you have reaped many benefits from being an American. I surely have, and I'm a 99%er, but very grateful to be an American and will not apologize to anyone for this country. You don't see people trying desparately to get into other countries any way they can.
Your uhmmm, knowledge of history is severely lacking depth. Unfortunately, I only have time to address one of your ludicrous statements. Americans looted nothing. Hitler looted nearly the entire continent of Europe and used the captured as slaves to finance his war of hate and "supremacy." As such, your post is quite pathetic and I suggest you tell mommy to call your uhmmm, schools and get your tuition refunded. Sad really.
Your uhmmm, knowledge of history is severely lacking depth. Unfortunately, I only have time to address one of your ludicrous statements. Americans looted nothing. Hitler looted nearly the entire continent of Europe and used the captured as slaves to finance his war of hate and "supremacy." As such, your post is quite pathetic and I suggest you tell mommy to call your uhmmm, schools and get your tuition refunded. Sad really.
Britain in the same wars your mentioning, although we did have to give up the Empire built in earlier times. We stopped dictators taking over Europe four times I can think of off the top of my head. And we did it with out the years of hesitation America showed in the last two times. What is it that makes America think they were the only ones who sacrificed for the word wars. The country that lost more soldiers than any other in both, INDIA. And they don't brag about it constantly. Without Indian troops the Japanese would have marched through Burma and gained control of the Indian Ocean making taking back those Islands a damn site more difficult.
Britain in the same wars your mentioning, although we did have to give up the Empire built in earlier times. We stopped dictators taking over Europe four times I can think of off the top of my head. And we did it with out the years of hesitation America showed in the last two times. What is it that makes America think they were the only ones who sacrificed for the word wars. The country that lost more soldiers than any other in both, INDIA. And they don't brag about it constantly. Without Indian troops the Japanese would have marched through Burma and gained control of the Indian Ocean making taking back those Islands a damn site more difficult.
Well Carlez, if you fail to see how we could give a country back to its inhabitants then you don't know any people that were involved in the Japanese or German occupation. Ask someone from Guam, the Philipines or Southeast Asia how they feel about Americans giving their country back to them by ridding their country of the intruders that took it from them. My familiy members were in Japanese concentration camps until the US Military took their country back from the Japanese and returned it to the rightful owners. They consider America as exceptional.
Well Carlez, if you fail to see how we could give a country back to its inhabitants then you don't know any people that were involved in the Japanese or German occupation. Ask someone from Guam, the Philipines or Southeast Asia how they feel about Americans giving their country back to them by ridding their country of the intruders that took it from them. My familiy members were in Japanese concentration camps until the US Military took their country back from the Japanese and returned it to the rightful owners. They consider America as exceptional.
Your knowledge of history is sadly lacking in scope, but then that is what I expect from someone raised on "American Exceptionalism". America did it's best to loot as many technological patents and industries from Germany that it could, and in a time when many German born people were being evicted from their lives, their possessions "confiscated", we were importing as many German scientists as we could trust.
Trust a greedy capitolist to think of nothing but gold.
(all snarky commentary below this point removed because the poster refuses to sink to such levels as name calling and empty insults to make himself feel intellectually superior. It's apparently not that hard… ok, almost all snarky commentary was removed)
Your knowledge of history is sadly lacking in scope, but then that is what I expect from someone raised on "American Exceptionalism". America did it's best to loot as many technological patents and industries from Germany that it could, and in a time when many German born people were being evicted from their lives, their possessions "confiscated", we were importing as many German scientists as we could trust.
Trust a greedy capitolist to think of nothing but gold.
(all snarky commentary below this point removed because the poster refuses to sink to such levels as name calling and empty insults to make himself feel intellectually superior. It's apparently not that hard… ok, almost all snarky commentary was removed)
Sounds like Charlez would be a lot happier living somewhere else; like outside the U.S! Frankly, the families of those brave soldiers who've given their lives to combat tyranny and evil around the world couldn't disagree with him more. Their sacrifices have permitted him to sound off in forums like this. He should be grateful for the opportunity to publicly embarass himself and demonstrate his exceptional idiocy! While I'm not totally pleased with all our government has done 'for us' and 'in our best interests', I wouldn't choose to live anywhere else under any other system!
Sounds like Charlez would be a lot happier living somewhere else; like outside the U.S! Frankly, the families of those brave soldiers who've given their lives to combat tyranny and evil around the world couldn't disagree with him more. Their sacrifices have permitted him to sound off in forums like this. He should be grateful for the opportunity to publicly embarass himself and demonstrate his exceptional idiocy! While I'm not totally pleased with all our government has done 'for us' and 'in our best interests', I wouldn't choose to live anywhere else under any other system!
Dale Dilts Good post. In addition to your list we are the most GENEROUS nation IN THE WORLD! NOONE comes close. Charlez is a liberal revisionist who has read the history books that have been dumbed down and we can tell from his dum post. He is what is called a "useful idiot" He fits perfectly.
Peter Collinson – To my knowledge, no one in this forum alluded to 'Americans thinking (or saying) that they were the ONLY ones to sacrifice in the wars. BTW, your entire post has nothing to do with the term "American Exceptionalism" either. If you believe so, you are yet another brainwashed 'useful idiot'
All true regarding the WWII era, but that was also 70 years ago. Following that era we began overthrowing countries with CIA coups, installing and supporting puppet dictators around the world and fighting proxy wars. A few low points: Moseddegh in Iran in '53, Arbenz in Guatemala in '54, the whole Vietnam debacle, Allende in Chile in '73, half a dozen in various African nations in the 60's and 70's, Contras in Nicaragua in the 80's, Suharto in Indonesia from the 60's-90's, Mubarak in Egypt for about 30 years…
That kind of undermines the idea that we are so exceptional and benevolent.
Dale Dilts, You don't know what American exceptionalism means, do you?
I am happy you provided a perfect example of the mindset, supported by an odd grab bag of tendentious rationalizations, that is promoted by the type of social studies instruction being inflicted on the unsuspecting children of Nebraska.
Edwards Greg, step back for one second and ask yourself this, why would the US support those kinds of people? Could it be we were choosing who we thought was the lesser of two evils or who would be a thorn in the side of our dearest enemy; the Soviets? Have you completely forgotten what we were fighting against after WW2? Oh yes, COMMUNISM and we did some desperate things! Indeed, the USA has supported some very shady characters since the end of WW2 but you can't just say this without giving credit to the noble/good ones whom we have supported who are more numerous. Looking back at our history since WW2 and some of the mistakes that have been made on the foreign policy front with respect to those leaders whom you mentioned above; I use the analogy of how many times one species is introduced to get rid of another species in nature. Quite often, it back fires right?
Charlez, please move to a different country. It will be the best thing for your sorry but to do. Have a great evening.
Edwards Greg – Perhaps some of your points are debatable but your conclusion proves you are another who do not understand the concept or definition of the term "American Exceptionalism"
Charlez Kenshol still on the crack I see. Clearly you swallowed all the crap some teacher shoved down your throat. Congrats on the successful brainwash. You privileged anti-America asswipes make me sick. If you don't like it here, if you don't believe America is the greatest country on the planet, feel free to move ( to another planet )
Justin: Attributing our foreign policy decisions to some sense of magnanimity and benevolence is a common perceptual error by most Americans. I've served in the military and find a lot of that sentiment there in order to justify deployment and campaigns — at least initially. Those foreign policy decisions could just as easily, and more plausibly, be attributed to national economic and political interests. Take petroleum, for example. I would suggest it's the primary reason we supported repressive regimes in Iran (Shah era), Saudi Arabia and many other Gulf dictatorships, Indonesia, Venezuela (pre-Chavez), Azerbaijan, and Nigeria just to name a few of the biggest. Coincidentally, those all all tops in petroleum and natural gas production, aren't they?
Edwards Greg – You have posted another irrelevant point since USFP has NOTHING to do with the issue at hand. Just for fun, I'll submit that each time the US has actually done what you allude to, it was an attempt to correct a bad situation and yes, protect our interests…why not? Nevertheless, while these "corrections" actually worked well for a time, there are no guarantees that the remedy deployed will ALWAYS work. For example in the case of Iran, the Shah was supported because he was replacing religious fanatics (sound familiar?) who repressed the entire country. He actually did a great job of modernizing the country, built infrastructure, etc. and helped get them out of the third world. Unfortunately, he became corrupt with power and the Muslim clerics took back control…we all know how that worked out for Iran (and the US). So, if you are going to go to history to support your position, it would be awesome if you would include all of the cause and effect, as opposed to cherry picking facts to support a rather lame position…especially one that is off topic.
Edwards Greg – "Attributing our foreign policy decisions to some sense of magnanimity and benevolence is a common perceptual error by most Americans."
First, tell me what country HAS ever conducted themselves with complete magnanimity and benevolence? Are you saying that America, as the world’s greatest power since 1941 should sit by and do nothing? Do you want to know what the worst kind of leadership is? Leadership that does nothing. Do you want to know what the worst kind of citizen is? One that enjoys the fruits of what their country has done for them but it is so quick to criticize. The policies our country foments and executes as a LEADER in this world of ours, may indeed have multitudes of self-interest layered in, but I assure you that in all the complexities that are involved in reaching these decisions are left to people with far greater information, perspective, and resources that you and I. When, we, the army execute decisions within our operating environment, there are many factors within the decision making process. So is there too within our government. It is not just as simple as, we are doing this for OIL.
Is America on the wrong side of history? I don't think so because it has vastly done more good than harm for this world than any other country that has ever sat where America sits. For all of its mistakes, YOUR perception of American magnanimity and benevolence has been vastly construed by its failures. Yes, our political class and policy makers should be held accountable to their mistakes just as any countries leaders should. But execusably, of course, every country is going to, within its own calculations of self-interest, execute actions and policies that have unforeseen tertiary effects that can have some pretty severe negative consequences on others. There are many tight ropes to walk. Bottom line, you can't make everybody happy. There are going to be winners and losers. Just depends on what side you support. Real leadership is leadership that makes the tough decisions, sometimes whether that is perceived right or wrong.
Justin: I only used petroleum as one easily understood example to illustrate that our foreign policy decisions are not made out of a simple sense of doing good in the world. Your straw man question regarding which country has ever conducted itself with complete magnanimity and benevolence is a loaded one and we both know the answer is none. Still, I never suggested we should do this.
I don't think America comes out on the right or wrong side of history; I think our accomplishments and faults pretty much cancel each other out when weighed out. But I do believe that the age of American exceptionalism is over, and I am not alone. I share the same opinion as Andrew Bacevich, for example. Being in the Army, maybe you're familiar with him, maybe not. But you certainly cannot say he is uninformed or an America hater like many Fox Newsies say about anyone who disagrees with the rah-rah-America sentiment.
Thank you for your comments. I enjoy polite and informed discussions.
TOO FUNNY! Someone actually wrote a U.S. History TEXT book and it never mentioned WASHINGTON? GEORGE WASHINGTON……….HELLLO? "Earlier drafts"….meaning the SAME peopleTHEN rewrote it? HELLO?
You write a Histoy book and never mention George Washinton and don't get fired? GOD BLESS AMERICA.
OK, Everyone else can be exceptional except the sod buster retards in Nebraska.
I'm appalled at what the kids are NOT learning. I heard some students being interviewed on TV who could not answer simple questions like who the Founding Fathers were or who we won our independence from. What the heck are they learning? I bet they know more about global warming than they do about our government and American Exceptionalism.
Mostly they just know about hit TV shows, celebrities, video games, pop music and professional sports.
I knew who those people were before I went to school. Maybe we need to have our parents take some responsibility for their children instead of having the government and teachers raise them. Now that is a unique thought!
I believe the problem is public schooling in general. I'd support a voucher system if we could put schools in competition and give people choices.
they never taught me about the contras in school. why?
Actually Nick, what they are taught is how to fist, where to get free condoms and parental unknown abortions (as opposed to simply using birth control in the first place). They know every popular celebrity that is known simply because they have managed to disburse a sex tape (no kidding! That's about all you have to do to be a celebrity these days) that Christians are monsters and believing in God is akin to mass suicide. They cannot count out change if the cash register is not working due to an electric failure, rank in the 94th percentile in the WORLD on standardized tests by the time they are in 8th grade, that everyone is equal so they really don't need to worry about the future as the 'government' is going to take care of them (I have actually had High School students TELL me that this is what their teachers are teaching them!) Surprisingly enough, younger students, especially those who are just starting school and are therefore more influenced by their parents then teachers, are actually testing in the top 5 percentile across the world. Our drop out rate is at an all time record high simply because our children actually REALIZE they are smarter, in most cases, then the teachers that hire them and do little more then waste our tax dollars indoctrinating them into the Liberalism that has taken over this country through 'PC' attitudes and the hatred they spew at anyone who doesn't buy into their liberal theocracy. I worked hard to send my children to private schools as much as I could, and they learned the difference it makes and now send their own children to private schoold rather then lose them in the public system. We DO have the power to change what is going on in the schools today, if you can get everyone to stick together from state to state and insist on quality teachers, educational programs and insist that flooding more money into the existing system (which has been going on for years needlessly) which continues to fail regardless, will no longer be acceptable.
Jeff Grundman: That's probably the same thing I knew as a kid, too. (Well, except for video games, of course.) Children can be self centered. Hopefully, we grow up!
Good post Mr Grundman. It is disgusting what little our kids know. Ask them sometime to name their state Senators and even how many they have or the name of the VP, Speaker of the House, If prez and vice prez are both dead who then gets to be President. They do not know the basics. Even Capitalism and it's benefits have disappeared from our schools. No wonder they listen to the Marxist in Chief we now have as president and believe his vision! What our schools teach is condoms, abortion, gay rights, free stuff they can get etc etc. It is no wonder we are in trouble. These kids old enough to vote are not only ignorant of their country's political and economic history but have no concept of freedom, personal responsibility and sooooooo much more. YES, I accept the blame for letting "teachers" have too much say in what we teach. It's no wonder obama the least experienced president in history, was elected. There is a lot of work to do to get us back on the right track. I pray God gives us another chance and instills in the electorate this election the wisdom to see where obama suggest we go will be our downfall. ABO!
Teachers unions are deciding what kids need to learn? This is all this junk from the multiculturalism crowd that says we are no different than anyone else. We are no special that anyone else, we are all the same.
How those over educated idiots ever came up with that observation is exactly why our kids in government run education centers cannot compete in the world.
This is how utterly ignorant the multicultural crowd is. The United States has has accomplished phenomenal things in our short existence compared to other societies. And how did we accomplish this exceptional feat? People from all over the world coming to this Country and joining in working for the American dream. The key phrase is, "People from all over the world." Isn't that multicultural itself, other people coming to this country joining in with others and working towards the same goal of making this Country greater than it is already? And all the while sharing their former countries experiences with other Americans. Please notice I left the hyphens out. We are Americans period, none of this hyphen-American crap that the multicultural crowd tries to shove down everyone's throats.
Besides if this Country is as bad as the Government run education centers say we are then why is everyone still trying to get in? Our government run schools are an abysmal failure that we keep throwing money into and getting no return. There are post graduate college students out there that think the War Between the States was in 1965.
The concept of American Exceptionalism and encouraging awareness of other cultures are NOT mutually exclusive to one another. In fact, I believe that with a solid foundation of knowledge built upon the principles our GREAT country is based on, learning about the diversity in the world only reinforces the fact that the U.S.A. is absolutely unique in the history of human civilization in a totally AWESOME way! We don't need to actively promote our fundamental values by pointing out the flaws of others, stick to the facts and most reasonable people will be able to see the truth of things and come to the obvious conclusions about the nation and our role in the world. Maybe where I am from in Ohio leans a little conservative but I find it hard to believe that there is that large of a percentage of the population looking to subvert the American way of life… The crackpots just bang their pots and pans together acting like fools while the vast silent majority either shakes their head in disbelief, or ignores the nonsense while continuing the pursuit of the American Dream.
@Devin Ornella – SPOT ON Devin. See folks, here is a superb post from someone who actually understands the subject matter and terminology. LIBTOOL ALERT! This is the proper definition so step away from your keyboards, read and learn something and stop wasting everyone's time.
American Exceptionalism is a fluke and a crock. That is the sort of mentality that has brought on war and hatred upon our country. The United States of America is a great country, but it is in no way above anyone else. Its misguided nationalism that does nothing more than harm this country, its people, and its standing among other nations.
It would be interesting to see what they do with the American Government/Constitution course.
I am a mother with three sons in the state of Nebraska and this makes me so angry! Why were parents now aloud to be a voice in this decission!
I am sure those who want to leave out the founding fathers and the attack against exceptionalism have to be from Omaha and the campus at Lincoln.
There must not be any exceptional Nebraskans for this debate to surface!
America seems to be facing a pivotal moment: Do we move ahead by advancing or by receding—by reaffirming the values that made us exceptional or by letting go of those values, so that the creeping mediocrity of Socialism begins to spare us the burdens of greatness?
Global Warming has been proven fraudulent. The Climate Gate emails showed this along with the outrageous predictions the IPCC made (using climategate data).
You need to read more current info and do stay away from Faux News where truth telling is non-existent.
So why don't you provide that current BS info.
@Dan Johanson…… and you need to reclaim your manhood and stay away from PMS-NBC.
OK, probably too late for the former, but you still have a shot at the latter.
OH I don't know Dan, if you listen to the other outlets, they pretty much omit any topic of political interest. I believe their mission is to safeguard our race to the bottom.
No, it hasn't. Global warming is very real, and you haven't a clue of those emails beyond what foxnews tells you. Have any of you conservatives ever heard of planet Venus? It's between Earth and Mercury. Yet, it is much hotter then Mercury. Why? Because Venus has a thick CO2 atmosphere. CO2 is a green house gas, the more of it in our atmosphere the more heat we will trap. This is FACT. Why conservatives put politics before the fate of our planet is beyond me.
Thats a good one. According to recent SCIENTIFIC data of tree rings preserved since 134BC as well as other reports the earth has been cooling due to its proximity to the sun. So you can keep espousing your CO2 filled exhaled rhetoric on your plastic (comes from crude oil) electric (comes from coal and other not very renewable sources) computer…
@Chinito…… IF you have the COURAGE to challenge your own ignorance, look at world history during the years 800 through about 1350 AD… things got very warm… so warm that there was a population explosion in Scandinavia….. then got so cold that the settlements in Greenland disappeared and Iceland came within a hair's breath of doing the same.
The SUN…. in case you didn't know.. and you probably didn't…is a giant uncontrolled thermal-nuclear chain reaction….. imagine a great big hydrogen bomb with many billions of years worth of fuel. It accounts for the light on heat on this planet.
Now I know this is going to come as a shock to you, and I don;t want you crying yourself to sleep, but the fact of the matter is… the SUN does NOT have a little round Honeywell thermostat on it keeping it regulated at a steady 72 degrees Fahrenheit. It runs hot sometimes, and sometimes it runs cold.
Please send me a certified check for whatever amount you overpaid to whoever mis-educated you…. and for the sake of the planet… please do not breed, spawn, or otherwise procreate. Gaia thanks you.
Dan Johanson Whether or not "global warming" exists is irrelevant. What IS relevant is that the Democrats LOVE having or creating "crises" so they can have an excuse to bot "save" us and tax the crap out of us. it IS that simple.
No, global warming has NOT been proven fraudulent. Climate Gate itself was fraudulent. You might want to update your info on this subject.
The emails were not fabricated and the IPCC scientists were upset with the data and discussed altering it. The emails were AUTHENTIC and not denied. But go on with your hypocritical beliefs whilst you live in the lap of modern luxury invented and perfected by those goddamned (wait, scratch that you prolly hate god too) capitalist countrymen. And please dont tell me how much toilet paper to use.
Phil, for the first time in the last 600,000 years, Atmospheric CO2 is above 400 PPM. CO2 is a greenhouse gas, this is a FACT. More CO2 means more heat. Secondly Phil Cohen, your using a logical fallacy. A Previous pattern in history does not refute the fact that current atmospheric CO2 is rising, DUE TO HUMAN ACTIVITY. CO2 is a greenhouse gas, it traps heat. Another fact. You do the math.
It's sad how so many people that claim to be educated cannot tell you what the difference is between climate change and man made global warming. Nor can they provide you any real proof that man made global warming even exists beyond Al Gore told them so. Could the earth be going through a period of climate change? Absolutely. Could man be causing it or in any way change it? Not likely. The earth is going to continue heating up and cooling down regardless of anything we do.
Rolo Tomassi right, Earth is cooling. That's why year after year record highs continue to be broke, and why a graph of global temperatures shows a rise. Then again what do I expect from FOXnews viewers, people so smug in their politics they'd put them before the fate of our world.
Chinito, if you went to college and took any science classes, you should demand a full refund immediately. They failed to teach you anything about climate cycles, the sun, or the fact that the earth will never exist with a stable climate, that never changes temperature, regardless of the species inhabiting it. You have been successfully indoctrinated into believing that man controls the climate of the planet.
Chinito Reivax since you are so fond of graphs, I would be happy to show you some that show not only has the earth gotten hotter in the past, it has also gotten colder and we have had these bizarre things called "Ice Ages". And guess what? It's going to happen again. The earth will get warmer, and then it will get colder. And in between there will be smaller periods of heating and cooling. Amazing I know. That college education really pays off when some liberal is trying to blow smoke up your ass to make a living. cough Al Gore cough.
I only watch MSNBC and CNN to see what the communists are up to. I keep my enemies closer . FYI parts of the globe are experiencing record lows as well. Plant a tree or stop breathing out C02 and save the world yourself.
We dont coltron it grant but we can influence it. Like I said, atmospheric CO2 is NO ABOVE 400 PPM, THE HIGHEST IT HAS BEEN in recent times! Even in the time Phil Cohen was rambling about, Atmosphric CO2 was just below 300 PPM. If CO2 is a green house gas, and it is, and it begins to build up in our atmosphere, and it is, DO THE MATH. It is you who should get the refund on a degree Jason, you are using logical fallacies. The fact that we've had Ice ages (which I doubt you even know the cause of) does nothing to dispute the fact that atmospheric CO2 in our atmosphere is increasing. So far all you deniers on this article have done is spout off about how Earth's climate was different in the past. THAT DOES NOT DISPROVE what's happening to the climate now. Tell me Einstein, what do you think will happen as CO2 levels keep increasing?
Trees and shrubs will breathe better
Rolo Tomassi Trees and shrubs only use about 20 percent of the CO2 we put into the air. More CO2 doesn't simply mean plants breathe better. They only use so much in respiration.
The thing you and others, concidentally make no mention of is the CO2. Of all the global warming denials and skeptical posts in this thread, not a single one makes mention of the atmospheric CO2 levels. Not one. CO2 is a greenhouse gas. It's simple physics.
Oddly enough I have a structure called a greenhouse 12'x20'. Some of my fellow hobbyists have to add C02 artificially since the plants actually use up all of it. Its called CO2 enrichment. Dude, your outgunned here. I care about you but you gotta stop with the chicken little routine… Be cool like Fonzarelli.
Oddly enough I have a structure called a greenhouse 12'x20'. Some of my fellow hobbyists have to add C02 artificially since the plants actually use up all of it. Its called CO2 enrichment. Dude, your outgunned here. I care about you but you gotta stop with the chicken little routine… Be cool like Fonzarelli.
Everything I said is completely logical and has been proven by decade upon decade of scientific research. On the other hand, we have you and the global warming crowd screaming that the sky is falling and the only data you have at hand to prove your theory was manipulated by the scientists doing the research. There is no need to try to disprove a theory that is based on bullshit manipulated data. No one know for a fact if rising CO2 levels cause rising temperature, or if it is in fact the other way around. Rising temperatures causing a rise in CO2 in the atmosphere. Here is a nice quote for you: "Compared to former geologic periods, concentrations of CO2 in our atmosphere are still very small and may not have a statistically measurable effect on global temperatures. For example, during the Ordovician Period 460 million years ago CO2 concentrations were 4400 ppm while temperatures then were about the same as they are today."
Everything I said is completely logical and has been proven by decade upon decade of scientific research. On the other hand, we have you and the global warming crowd screaming that the sky is falling and the only data you have at hand to prove your theory was manipulated by the scientists doing the research. There is no need to try to disprove a theory that is based on bullshit manipulated data. No one know for a fact if rising CO2 levels cause rising temperature, or if it is in fact the other way around. Rising temperatures causing a rise in CO2 in the atmosphere. Here is a nice quote for you: "Compared to former geologic periods, concentrations of CO2 in our atmosphere are still very small and may not have a statistically measurable effect on global temperatures. For example, during the Ordovician Period 460 million years ago CO2 concentrations were 4400 ppm while temperatures then were about the same as they are today."
Also, if there is still a question in your mind about the data, I invite you to look at the graph on this page that is absolutely correct. And it proves that hysterics like yourself have zero scientific education to even back up what you are saying and are simply jumping on the global warming train to be like the rest of the liberals.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1644060/posts
Also, if there is still a question in your mind about the data, I invite you to look at the graph on this page that is absolutely correct. And it proves that hysterics like yourself have zero scientific education to even back up what you are saying and are simply jumping on the global warming train to be like the rest of the liberals.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1644060/posts
Rolo Tomassi If you dont provide enough CO2 to begin with of coruse they will use it all up Einstein. HOwever if you were to enrich your greenhouse with CO2 above a certain amount, you will get excess because they can not use it all.
Rolo Tomassi If you dont provide enough CO2 to begin with of coruse they will use it all up Einstein. HOwever if you were to enrich your greenhouse with CO2 above a certain amount, you will get excess because they can not use it all.
Jason Grant How about addresssing the CO2 Jason? Do you think we can just pump as much of it into the atmosphere as we want and NOTHING willl happen?
Jason Grant How about addresssing the CO2 Jason? Do you think we can just pump as much of it into the atmosphere as we want and NOTHING willl happen?
lol, you have no clue about the historical levels of CO2 in our atmosphere do you? When you look back only 400,000 years, like good old Uncle Al, it looks high today in comparison. But then look back over millions of years and our current atmospheric CO2 level is at least ten times less and the temperature of the planet was roughly the same. I hate to throw facts in the way of your argument, but someone had to do it.
lol, you have no clue about the historical levels of CO2 in our atmosphere do you? When you look back only 400,000 years, like good old Uncle Al, it looks high today in comparison. But then look back over millions of years and our current atmospheric CO2 level is at least ten times less and the temperature of the planet was roughly the same. I hate to throw facts in the way of your argument, but someone had to do it.
Also jason your graph hurts your argument. In the Pelozoic era the Earth was much hotter than it is now. By your graph also, atmospheric CO2 was also much higher then as well! So gee…a era where it was hotter, also had more CO2. The only difference between the paleozoic and now however, is Humans. US. we are dumping more CO2 in the atmosphere from our activities. Your graph even directly correlates higher CO2 with higher temps! So Einstein.. if we dump more CO2 into the air, it will get warmer. Your own graph proves that.
Also jason your graph hurts your argument. In the Pelozoic era the Earth was much hotter than it is now. By your graph also, atmospheric CO2 was also much higher then as well! So gee…a era where it was hotter, also had more CO2. The only difference between the paleozoic and now however, is Humans. US. we are dumping more CO2 in the atmosphere from our activities. Your graph even directly correlates higher CO2 with higher temps! So Einstein.. if we dump more CO2 into the air, it will get warmer. Your own graph proves that.
I think you need to learn to read a graph then. There is actually no correlation between global temperature and CO2 levels on that graph. None whatsoever. There are points on the graph where CO2 and temperature are both high, other points where one is high and one is low, and points where they both decrease. There is no direct correlation on that graph at all.
Hell there are a few points on that graph where CO2 is dropping dramatically and temperature is increasing dramatically.
Yes there is! Are you blind? On your graph CO2 decreases from the Cambrian to the Ordovician. Gee so does temperature. CO2 then increases from the Ordovician to the Silurian. So does tempreature. Then CO2 decreases to the Devonian. Gee, on the grah so does temperature! CO2 then decreases from the Devonian to the Carbonifcerous.. and gee.. so does temperature! Stays level from Carbo. to Permian. Gee so does temp. CO2 increases from Permian to triasssic…. gee, SO DOES TEMPERATURE. Your own graph shoots your argument in the foot, for the obvious reason: CO2 IS A GREEN HOUSE GAS. You can't deny this.
Jason Grant "Hell there are a few points on that graph where CO2 is dropping dramatically and temperature is increasing dramatically. " You need to learn how to read graphs. It's called lead and lag Einstein.
I think you are seriously misinterpreting that graph. All I can suggest is you go back to school because you are making a fool out of yourself. All you have to do is look on the left and see the downward trend in CO2 and the fact that the temperature fluctuates up and down independently of CO2 level to see that there is no direct correlation. You don't get to pick and choose one single point to say "oh look, there's proof". All you have to do is look at the entire graph to see that the line for CO2 and the line for temperature fluctuate independently of one another over the course of history. I can't be blamed for your lack of ability to understand a simple graph. Sorry.
There is no lead or lag on that graph. And thanks for calling me Einstein. I may not be as smart as him, but I am a Medical Doctor and obviously much smarter than you
Chinito, you can go on about carbon dioxide all you want, but the number one gas that determines atmospheric temperature is water vapor. Given that 75 percent of the surface of the planet is covered with water, there's no way the amount of water vapor will ever be controlled. Also, any purported temperature variations on Earth have also been observed on Mars and in Jupiter's atmosphere — strongly pointing to solar variation — not the drop in the bucket that is human activity — that causes any warming.
But let's assume for the moment you're right and the planet is warming. If that's the case, trying to stop it is foolish and just as logistically impossible as filling in the Grand Canyon. We should instead be devising ways of living with the changes.
Dan Johanson Here you go: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2171973/Tree-ring-study-proves-climate-WARMER-Roman-Medieval-times-modern-industrial-age.html
A study came out yesterday debunking global warming as it has been cooling for the last 2000 years. Sad thing is, that study wasnt' covered in any US press. Not even fox news. It is in the UK news though if you are interested in finding it.
Chinito Reivax You should do the math, the heat trapping of co2 is not linear. It doesn't directly relate to temperatrue, Besides 400 ppm is lest than 4 tenths of one percent. The water vapor is the main greenhouse gas. Try to stop water from evaporating.
This is correct. C02 enrichment does not change the temp of my greenhouse. I still have to heat it in the winter just as much. The larger the greenhouse environment the less gases have an effect. Sort of like the stench of communist china doesnt make it to the US except in ideology.
EVERY ONE OF THESE MORONS DESERVES A PINK SLIP! THEIR LAZY UNION BOSSES CAN EXPLAIN IT TO THEM! OUR HISTORY IS AWESOME! YEAH THERE WERE A BUNCH OF PROBLEMS THAT NEEDED TO BE FIXED. FOR EXAMPLE THE SLAVE TRADE WAS WRONG, BLAME GEORGIA! I'D BET YOU CAN'T FIND ANYONE OF THESE NITWIT EDUCATORS WHO COULD WRITE A DOCUMENT AS ELEGANT AND AWESOME AS THE U.S. CONSTITUTION.
AMERICAN EXCEPTIONALISM IS WHAT PUT OUR FLAG ON THE MOON, CREATED AIRPLANES, CREATED THE INTERNET, CREATED APPLE AND MICROSOFT (BY THE WAY THESE WERE CREATED WITHOUT THE IGNORANCE OF ANY UNIVERSITY PROFESSORS)!
AMERICAN PUBLIC EDUCATION IS AN UTTER EMBARRASSMENT OVER ALL. I REALLY FEEL SORRY FOR THE 10-20% OF THE EDUCATORS WHO ACTUALLY EARN THEIR MONEY AND TAKE PRIDE IN TEACHING. I AM SICK OF SUBSTANDARD UNION EDUCATORS WHINING ABOUT THEIR PAYCHECKS AND THEIR BENEFITS. HERE'S AN IDEA GROW A PAIR OF BALLS MAN UP AND DO SOMETHING ELSE! OUR EDUCATION SYSTEM SUCKS BECAUSE THE UNIONS DON'T HAVE THE GUTS TO LET SOME OF THESE TWITS GO.
I agree with you, but please please please stop using all caps.
Sorry Mike. I just get overly excited about this issue!
EVERY ONE OF THESE MORONS DESERVES A PINK SLIP! THEIR LAZY UNION BOSSES CAN EXPLAIN IT TO THEM! OUR HISTORY IS AWESOME! YEAH THERE WERE A BUNCH OF PROBLEMS THAT NEEDED TO BE FIXED. FOR EXAMPLE THE SLAVE TRADE WAS WRONG, BLAME GEORGIA! I'D BET YOU CAN'T FIND ANYONE OF THESE NITWIT EDUCATORS WHO COULD WRITE A DOCUMENT AS ELEGANT AND AWESOME AS THE U.S. CONSTITUTION.
AMERICAN EXCEPTIONALISM IS WHAT PUT OUR FLAG ON THE MOON, CREATED AIRPLANES, CREATED THE INTERNET, CREATED APPLE AND MICROSOFT (BY THE WAY THESE WERE CREATED WITHOUT THE IGNORANCE OF ANY UNIVERSITY PROFESSORS)!
AMERICAN PUBLIC EDUCATION IS AN UTTER EMBARRASSMENT OVER ALL. I REALLY FEEL SORRY FOR THE 10-20% OF THE EDUCATORS WHO ACTUALLY EARN THEIR MONEY AND TAKE PRIDE IN TEACHING. I AM SICK OF SUBSTANDARD UNION EDUCATORS WHINING ABOUT THEIR PAYCHECKS AND THEIR BENEFITS. HERE'S AN IDEA GROW A PAIR OF BALLS MAN UP AND DO SOMETHING ELSE! OUR EDUCATION SYSTEM SUCKS BECAUSE THE UNIONS DON'T HAVE THE GUTS TO LET SOME OF THESE TWITS GO.
American Exceptionalism: The rare event of freeing a people from a tyrannical government and not replacing it with a tyrannical government. (The French Revolution, or more recently, Egypt) A county founded on We the People. A county respecting the rights of men as revealed by Nature's God. A country based on earned success.
American Exceptionalism: The rare event of freeing a people from a tyrannical government and not replacing it with a tyrannical government. (The French Revolution, or more recently, Egypt) A county founded on We the People. A county respecting the rights of men as revealed by Nature's God. A country based on earned success.
Ummmmmm… believing in "exceptionalism" is misguided. You don't have to demonize another culture nor proclaim it less fitting in order to celebrate America's culture. I'm pretty sure people in Japan, England, Italy, Korea, etc, etc, etc, are pretty proud of their culture's too. Moreover, global warming (evolution, gravity) is a fact and to deny that is nothing more than grinding an axe.
"global warming " is NOT a fact.. at best it's a theory… at worst it's simply a mechanism, a "crisis" the Democrats can use to fleece Americans and impose more stupid regulations. Even IF there is data to support the theory, the data is still in doubt, as there is a clear pattern of data suppression going on that does NOT support "global warming" or climate change or whatever silly "goodspeak" liberals are using this week.
Global warming is very much backed by facts, by empirical evidence, by mountains of data, none of which is in doubt, except by Foks.
Jeff Scheidel – Global Warming is indeed proving to be nonsense since it is based upon speculative computer modeling and driven by progressives. It is also wrong to summarily conclude that it is caused by man.
Apparently you haven't been paying much attention to the wildly changing weather patterns OR the quickly disappearing ice caps OR the rising sea levels that are making countries like Tuvalu literally disappear.
Blah, Blah, Blah; progressive speak & noise…all natural occurrences. Evidently, you need to actually read my post on this subject because it is apparent you have not. I gave you 9-links, 3 independent websites and a book ALL published by PhD's from MIT and other prestigious institutions…but I know, that isn't good enough because no matter what, you believe in global warming…and besides, Al Gore says it is so. Still laughing.
You're laughing out your can, then. It still remains that in every single poll, 97-98 percent of all scientists agree in the truth of climate change. Sea levels, average world temps, loss of ice, these are provable through empirical evidence that teabaggers and their brethren choose to ignore because their corporate masters tell them to do so.
Jeff Scheidel – No problem Jeff; you are doing the predicable thing; ignoring facts and mixing them with theory…I'm still laughing. I've said in previous posts, unlike you, I could not care less what others think or the results of polls…too easy to manipulate. I perform independent research by reading books from experts that have no agenda but to get things right. GW is a hoax AS A CRISIS. I know the effort is contributing to our bankruptcy. I know it is putting entire industries out of business. I know it is making all of us pay a great deal more for electricity and gasoline. I know it is propping up the economies of third world countries etc. I've never stated that the earth was not 'warming' – I dispute that it is a crisis and I dispute that it is man-made. Because of the strength and depth of the media, you believe that the vast majority of scientists have advocated that it is indeed a crisis which is patently false. They have simply confirmed that warming is occurring – the rest of it is BS and like a good corporate hating liberal; you sign on…that is why I'm laughing.
Anthony, you have no clue what you're talking about. See this: http://www.skepticalscience.com. Models predict what we are experiencing and reproduce past climates. You're way off base and not at all informed.
Randy Rasmussen you are incorrect. See http://www.skepticalscience.com
Al Wells – Nice try Al. Unfortunately, your hero John Cook is NOT a climate scientist and has frequently made a fool of himself. Basically, you have posted a link to just another liberal view. As I've pointed out before, we can all play that game finding dissenting information. For just two examples:
http://motls.blogspot.com/2010/03/john-cook-skeptical-science.html
(a step by step debunking of Cook's assertions)
http://nigguraths.wordpress.com/2011/10/10/skepticalscience-rewriting-history/
The only true facts regarding GW is that there are all-too-few facts and far too much conjecture and speculation driven mostly by computer modeling and political agenda. My other sited points (links/books) on this subject have been published in this forum and elsewhere. You can choose to believe what you wish but I doubt that you are adequately considering the sources of your information.
Randy, you are incorrect. Don't just fall for whatever you're spoon fed. If you want to argue facts, argue the actual science. See this link and learn something: skepticalscience.com
Anthony De Rubeis you are incorrect. Those "speculative computer models" successfully recreate past climates as well as predicting current realities. Learn something: http://www.skepticalscience.com
Anthony De Rubeis you are a total dolt. 100% ignorant. Skepticalscience is a blog that is based on FACTS as presented by ALMOST ALL CLIMATE SCIENTISTS. I used to be Lush Dimbaugh hard core ignoramus too. But, facts are facts. The only people in the science fields who do not agree with NASA (http://climate.nasa.gov/), NOAA (http://www.noaa.gov/climate.html) and 97% of the rest of the climate science community are kooks.
Anthony De Rubeis you are a total dolt. 100% ignorant. Skepticalscience is a blog that is based on FACTS as presented by ALMOST ALL CLIMATE SCIENTISTS. I used to be Lush Dimbaugh hard core ignoramus too. But, facts are facts. The only people in the science fields who do not agree with NASA (http://climate.nasa.gov/), NOAA (http://www.noaa.gov/climate.html) and 97% of the rest of the climate science community are kooks.
Al Wells -So lets see Al, I'm a "dolt", "100% ignorant" and a "hard-core ignoramus" – thanks libtool; a most underwhelming vocabulary. And, I'm all these things because you found A (aka single) website run by someone who IS NOT a climate scientist but you libsheep simply MUST follow the propaganda and, I've stated why…your progressive agenda.
Number one, you are illiterate since evidently, you can neither read nor comprehend my posts. Two, you CHOOSE to marginalize me as well as ALL of my links, experts and books written by scholars for the simple reason that they don't jive with your famous 97%. Three, you completely ignore that I've never denied the earth was warming; I just disagree with the reasons and the "solutions." What a shock. In the end, you and those of your ilk, have said nothing new, nothing factual, nothing verifiable and continue to point to the absurd non sequitor that "97% of the climate science community agrees" a dubious point that I've also addressed. At this point, it is likely best that you just continue to do what others tell you and NEVER pick up a book to educate yourself. Just keep relying on the blogs to tell you what to think and when to think it. BTW, the last time I looked, NASA is a government organization and thus, hardly independent.
Jeff Scheidel and yet.. still a theory. And clearly, the data IS in doubt.. YOU don't have the expertise to analyze it. You're taking the word of politically motivated sources. If they happen to be left leaning, you KNOW they can't be trusted. Clearly they just LOVE to cut and paste and obfuscate like crazy.
No, the data is not in doubt. The "jury is not out." It's not a simple majority, it's the VAST majority of the scientific world. You guys believe it's a hoax because corporate interests, which OWN the GOP top to bottom, don't want anybody messing with oil interests. And so they pay their political cronies to deny deny deny. And this means ignoring ALL the science.
Jeff Scheidel – Assuming your statements are correct (and they are not), then perhaps you and your scientists can tell us why the "warming" is far slower that predicted. What you still fail to acknowledge is that we might admit there is a warming, we just deny that there is any solid evidence that it is man-made or it is dangerous. Also, you have NEVER even attempted to explain why the US must adhere to some UN inspired global restrictions while China and India continue to make the world a cesspool. Since you rarely if ever research anything I will tell you…a misplaced global view of economics, political correctness and progressive bull shit.
One more "blob" of grease on the downhill slide.
There is NO DOUBT that given the accomplishments of this country on all fronts (including civil rights), given the amazing document that the founders gave us which protects freedom and rights, that America is clearly exceptional in the annuls of history. It is a sum total of the people – their belief system and fresh eyes (relative to the rest of the world) as to what government Of the People By the People, and For the People should be. Others can debate it all they want – many of us KNOW this country and its people are exceptional, and we are all lucky to be a part of it. (Even as others in our midst try to tear it down.)
We aren't dumbing down, we have arrived. Just let the N.E.A. run our school systems and we will get what we don't deserve.
The tea party is the best example of the dumbing down of America.
Dan Johanson
Is that what one of McKenyans partisan news services is telling you? You need to think clearly on this and quit getting high off of your own biological product.
Dan Johanson ..the computer that you type on is from where? What corporation made it? The clock you won't set to get out of bed for work in the morning is from a corporation, no? The sheets you'll sleep on if you have any that is, from what country now? If I had to guess, which was once a corporation from America! Since you are bashing the Tea Party, why is that? Because We don't want to pay outrageous taxes for the Obama's 18th vacation in 3 years? Or the PLANE rides for his speeches to promote himself as the healer of the planet on our TAX dollars. Hey STUPID…it's about Taxed ENOUGH Already….do you pay any taxes at all for that matter? Are you part of the 50% that PAY NO taxes at all? I guess you are for that matter. WE the people are sick of working hard and having our money sent to Mexico, China, Brazil, Egypt, Iran, and every other Muslim country that hate us. And the corrupt politicians that try so hard to control all of our lives…so what is your real beef about the TEA PARTY Stupid? {[[[crickets}}}}
Dan Johanson Dan.. Truth runs off you like water from a duck's back. Keep up the good work.
Kenyan? Ah … no.
Dan, the Tea Party is NOT the cross-section of America that's actually owning the bottom of the testing curve.
Dan, the Tea Party is NOT the cross-section of America that's actually owning the bottom of the testing curve.
Dan, you are right on. Glad to see that you are in FL, and will vote!
Did any tea party person ever take grade school math.Cuttiing programs and cuttiing taxes alone will never balance the budget.The math is not there.Revenues(taxes) must be increased.Cutting taxes for the middle class and not the wealthy is the way to create jobs.The wealthy are not major job creators.Republicnas lie about this ,climate change and just about everything else.We are currenlty paying less taxes now than decades ago.Republicans lie that we are being overtaxed.Bullcrap.Tea partiers also have racist and homophobic tendencies.You seem very un-American to me.
Joel Rivera Anybody who thinks that the budget can be balanced without raising revenue(taxes) needs to return to grade school math.
By all means, we should just keep cutting taxes for the top one percent, those people who obviously do NOT create jobs, so that the new cuts will keep adding to the deficit like the last round.
Dan Johanson – anyone who believes a $1Trillion ANNUAL budget deficit can be balanced with new taxes is an economic moron who never saw a calculator and who has no comprehension of a trillion dollars.
The deficit cannot be dealt with using either tax cuts OR budget cuts. It will take a combination, as EVERY economist has stated. The Bush tax cuts have always been sustainable. And tax cuts have never, ever paid for themselves by creating a stimulus. That was disproven decades ago.
Jeff Scheidel – I don't want to appear like I'm picking on you Jeff but your last post is just silly. Historically, tax cuts have not only paid for themselves, they increased revenue to the Treasury. The issue is that EVERY TIME revenue increases, Congress increases spending. Please don't bother with an inane response gleaned from a liberal blog – look it up. Here is a hint: when Ronald Reagan cut taxes to clean up Carter's economic debacle it DOUBLED revenue to the Treasury. His mistake was not mandating Congress cut spending hence deficits; so the media will tell you that his tax cuts did not work…see how they play you? They are lying and you are consequently wrong to repeat it.
Sorry, Tony, but that's more neocon b.s. Reagan raised taxes eleven times. Even his own economic adviser and economist agrees that the 1981 tax cuts didn't grow the Treasury. Inflation grew revenue, as did population growth, as did the economic expansion spurred by Reagan 's massive deficit spending, and as did Reagan's 11 tax increases. If Reagan's own team doesn't buy the baloney, why do YOU?
Jeff Scheidel – wrong again Jeff. You should stop reading things published or stated by Paul Krugman. He is Keynesian based economist and a political hack. The rates you are speaking of that were increased under Reagan were adjustments and the closing of loopholes. From '91-'86, he lowered the marginal individual income tax rate from 70% to 28% and there were major reversals of how we taxed business income. Did Reagan run deficits? Yes but Presidents don't control what is spent by Congress…they spent about $1.25 for every new dollar supply side economics and the new tax code provided. RR's mistake was not pushing hard enough for a balanced budget amendment. In short, RR's economic policies doubled revenue to the Treasury, reduced and controlled inflation and created millions of jobs…all this while ending the Cold War. Not too bad for a president that inherited a recession, double digit inflation, a double digit prime rate and a double digit unemployment figure. In essence, he raised revenue for every year from '84-'90. If you are asserting that Reagan's economic policy was indeed Keynesian, I'll laugh in your face.
Climate change is a fact. Ask NASA http://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/.
Climate change is a hoax!
it doesn't matter if it is or isn't a hoax. What matters is the Democrats will use, or manufacture a "crisis" at every opportunity to milk taxpayers and impose more stupid regulations. Lets get real.. even IF global warming is human caused, the ONLY fix is elimination of 3-4 BILLION people, then wait a few hundred years.
Mitch: Why do you believe that? Do you have any evidence to back that up? If I cite NASA and you cite nothing, who is more likely to be correct?
Randy: First off it does matter, because if climate change is real, then our kids should be taught the truth. Second, if it is real, then democrats aren't manufacturing a crisis. It's a real crisis and republicans are ignoring it. Third, what regulations do you believe are stupid? If they are stupid, they should be repealed, but republicans often just shout that regulations need to be cut without saying which or why. Fourth, why do you believe the only fix is eliminating billions of people? Do you have any background in climate science or any evidence to support that? The National Academies of Science and Princeton researchers disagree with you (http://cmi.princeton.edu/) so I'd be curious to see your critique of their work. Fifth, can you name other crises democrats have manufactured to milk taxpayers? Besides the fact that millions of people die every year without healthcare, what other crises are made up? What new taxes have been created?
Don't forget about the "crisis" of WMD that the Bushies created out of hot air so that they could justify an invasion, the single biggest blunder in our nation's history. Completely phony evidence.
The far right constantly decries regulation, but it's only a buzzword to them. IN 2008, after railing about the need to deregulate, Sarah Palin was asked which regulations she would roll back, and she couldn't name one. Deregulation in the 80's just about destroyed the airline industry. Banking deregulation in the 80's under Reagan caused the S& crisis, and we ended up bailing them out. And dereg helped cause the current econ crisis.
Mitch Matthiesen It's such a hoax that 98% of all scientists in this country, and a greater percentage elsewhere, believe it.
Jeff Scheidel – still posting liberal nonsense I see…
Instead of calling it nonsense, respond with evidence maybe? Also, since when is NASA liberal nonsense?
Will Newman – Sure Will – no problem Jeffrey…How much evidence would you like? Never mind answering; just shut up and do a little reading.
So I know you liberals love to see links. And, although I know from experience that none of the following samples (out of hundreds) will help since you will remain in denial. But while you are bowing your heads in reverence to liberal charlatans such as Al Gore and those of his ilk, there may just be ONE of you that actually examines this sampling of reality and gets a clue…we are being hosed…
http://www.wnho.net/global_warming.htm
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2012-07-10/news/ct-oped-0710-byrne-20120710_1_global-warming-climate-change-intergovernmental-panel
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2012/02/global_warming_skeptic_prof_lindzen_testifies_before_house_of_commons.html
Here is the professor’s presentation:
http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02148/RSL-HouseOfCommons_2148505a.pdf
http://epaabuse.com/5051/news/physicist-exposes-global-warming-hoax/
The physicist’s presentations:
http://www.ametsoc.org/chapters/oregon/Minutes/2012/2012_1_25_Meeting/2012_1_25_Presentations/2012_1_25_GordonFulksPhD.pdf
http://blip.tv/jim-karlock/climate-orthodoxy-perpetuates-a-hoax-5924187
And 16 other scientists back him up via the WSJ:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204301404577171531838421366.html?KEYWORDS=global+warming
http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/Global-Warming-Journal-Happer/2012/03/27/id/433983
At this point, and before you post your mighty, ‘Yes, but’ BS, there are additional sites you just might want to visit just to improve the chances that you may actually learn something today. Such as:
Climatedepot.com
Climatechangedispatch.com
Iceagenow.com
Plus MANY MORE
Lastly, in case your feeling particularly brilliant today, I suggest you read, "Hot Talk, Cold Science" by S. Fred Singer
Have a great weekend!
Liberal nonsense? Like the manufactured evidence that got us into Iraq? What's nonsensical about that? It's well documented. Sorry, pal, but you stink at this refutation thing.
YES, liberal nonsense since you have done exactly as I've predicted in my last post. I refuted your global warming BS quite easily and now you want to change the subject to WMD. Trust me, I can do the same thing to you with that piece of liberal tripe. Evidently, you either did not bother to read my post or you are illiterate. Anyone would think that with 9 factual links, 3 independent websites and a book, it would be sufficient to knock the GW myth to hell…if nothing else, it most certainly exposes people to the real science…but libs just know better. Hilarious and yet sad.
YES, liberal nonsense since you have done exactly as I've predicted in my last post. I refuted your global warming BS quite easily and now you want to change the subject to WMD. Trust me, I can do the same thing to you with that piece of liberal tripe. Evidently, you either did not bother to read my post or you are illiterate. Anyone would think that with 9 factual links, 3 independent websites and a book, it would be sufficient to knock the GW myth to hell…if nothing else, it most certainly exposes people to the real science…but libs just know better. Hilarious and yet sad.
You haven't refuted a thing. It still remains a FACT that the VAST MAJORITY of scientists here and around the world back up climate change. The evidence continues to pile up. Average mean temps, disappearing ice, rising sea levels, wacky weather changes. So-called Climate Gate was utter nonsense. Don't know how you can claim "real science" when a very tiny minority of scientists, including those paid by oil interests, are your only supporters. You only hear what you want to hear. This is why viewers of Foks Nooz are found by multiple polls to know the least about history, geography, current events, and science.
Well Jeff – I predicted you would neither agree nor respect my ample documentation. No worries; in fact, I could not care less. Stay exactly as you are.
The main difference between you and I is that I don't give a damn what "most" think…I find out for myself. I listen to the opinions of others but unless they can be supported by facts, I discard them and find out for myself. You point to scientists that support my position that have an agenda and I do the same to you. The fact is, my science makes logical sense an is growing while yours is manufactured, supported by computer modeling and as such, nothing more than a dissipating theory.
Another key difference between us is that you read blogs from those that write things of which you already agree. Conversely, I read everything and analyze all the data. Polls are a lame crutch used by those to manipulate others and the lazy who consume them…anyone who understands statistics and how polls are done should understand that they are easily contrived to achieve the outcome you wish. Therefore, polls are meaningless.
I don't know why you keep alluding to FOX since I've never brought them up or used them to support anything I've published. I also cannot fathom why people who think like you, loath FOX so much since they are only one cable network among a virtual worldwide sea of progressive media…but that is your problem.
Hi Anthony:
I agree, you can find a bunch of links on the internet saying global warming is a hoax. But it's not enough to just post a bunch of links. The links have to be from credible sources and the substance of the articles cited have to be persuasive. I am curious why NASA is not persuasive to you, but links to a pro-life website from Maine (the world net health organization, which is a group started by a bishop with no climate training) whose criticism of global warming is that it is "crapola" is persuasive to you. Similarly, the David Byrne column you cited constantly calls climate science suspect, but doesn't cite any hard numbers or figures or even specific criticisms (nor does he have any backrgound in science). (Richard Lindzen is an exception, I'll admit, but why do you agree with him and not the hundreds of other scientists? What did you find persuasive?) Why is this persuasive to you? In fact, all of the sites you linked to were political or conservative sites. Can you find a university or an actual respected scientific group that supports your claim? Or can you find any data (with numbers) that refutes the science you can find on the NASA site?
Climate science isn't opinion. You need a reason to believe one side and not the other, and I don't see any hard scientific reasons from the links you posted. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Will Newman – So we agree that links can be provided to support nearly any issue. It just so happens that those that purport validity of the GW theory are “progressives.” Since their agenda is substantial and well known, and, manipulative and incongruous to how I know great societies function, I completely discount anything they ‘want.’ For example, progressives want ‘social justice,’ sounds good but ‘social equality’ is better. They are pro-union (anti-Business); sounds good to protect workers rights but while we needed unions at the beginning of the last century, we have ample laws now to protect the worker and, unions have become political action groups despite what their memberships want…not so good. They want “strong public education” but rewrite history to excise things with which they don’t agree; dangerous to eradicate history. They also want to “protect” bad teachers….not too smart. They want strict environmental controls; sounds good and I might agree, but not at the complete expense of commerce. You get the idea…progressives have been just plain bad for America. Add to that the ‘one world government’ crowd and we are essentially neutralized as an independent freedom loving country.
Now, I will also agree with part of your assessment of my links; I did not take the time to completely assess each link, I simply submitted them as an example of how easy it is to support the other side of a debate. However, you cannot actually dispute the science (which is why I supplied the actual presentations) from Gordon Fulks, Lindzen and the book by Singer; backed by other publications and 16 other scientists is sufficient. I speculate that as with my top line submission, you also did not have the time to review the supporting materials in detail…I get it, no worries but their science is indeed sound and therefore good enough for me. I also reiterate that there are literally hundreds of links that are not steeped in politics that support my position…I never take what is offered by anyone as gospel. I perform independent research from all sources and make up my own mind. Therefore, to me, there is ample evidence that based on the far left agenda and ‘computer modeling,’ GW is an expensive and debilitating hoax designed to slow productivity of the powerful nations so as to allow time for countries such as India, SEA and China to “catch up.”
Lastly, I submit this food for thought…why is it that in the aforementioned countries, the environment is a cesspool with air that is un-breathable; yet, we in America are being subjected to the most stringent guidelines? Why is it that we are the richest country in the world (regarding our own natural resources) yet, we do not tap into them? Why are we being forced to buy oil when we have more than enough to supply the world? Since our technology has proven to the most innovative, why is it that solar, wind, and nuclear energies have not been proliferated and or perfected? France has been powered by nuclear energy for decades…why not the US? Ask yourself who or what is holding us back and why.
In closing, I do not deny the earth is slowly warming (albeit, much slower than predicted by the GW crowd); I just believe it is a natural occurrence and not affected by man. You may recall the hysteria that ensued in the early ‘70’s about the coming ice age…laughable now for sure but quite ‘real’ then…this nonsense is the same and, I’m not buying it. Thanks for remaining civilized in our exchange; it is refreshing. I hope I’ve provided a different perspective to consider.
I appreciate the exchange as well. That said, I think several of your assertions are baseless:
1) If neither of us are scientists, neither of us has any grounds to believe one group of scientists over the other. Instead, shouldn't we just both agree that 99% of trained climate scientists believe climate change is real? Why do you believe what you believe? Why is one group nonsense and not the other?
2) Using domestic oil is super expensive (think of the land value and labor costs) and super finite (we dont have enough fuel to last 5 years) and environmentally destructive (do you want to live near an oil refinery?)
3) Pro union is anti business? So if I support weekends, workplace safety and child labor laws, I'm anti business?
3) We don't use nuclear power as much because Americans are afraid of nuclear disasters, like 3 mile island or the recent Japanese disaster.
4) Even assuming smart climate policy was anti-business (which I contest), why should business be so important that it would be worth risking (even if it were only a small risk) all life on earth?
Will Newman – 1. No, nothing I’ve asserted is baseless since I’ve provided the backup. No, we are not scientists but I have a solid working knowledge of science. I also know what I know because there is ample evidence that our universities are filled with tenured PhD’s that are about 90+% liberal today so, its stands to reason that their views and subsequent conclusions are skewed…in other words, just as they have an agenda to foster socialism, political correctness etc., they have an agenda to make the ‘science work.’
While I have acknowledged that there is climate change occurring, I know it is far less than we have been lead to believe and I have concluded based on what I have researched, that it is not man-made but natural.
2. We have been force fed that there is a shortage of oil for nearly 50-years…it was BS then and remains BS today… there is no shortage of oil here or anywhere else…the notion that there is a shortage is manufactured to manipulate us and the price. Oil should never be more than $40/barrel. There has also been significant evidence that the US has untapped supplies of oil that dwarf the Middle East. Additionally, there are vast amounts of Natural Gas we could use but again, we are prevented from doing so; why? We cannot pursue resources under the flood of environmental activism. I wish we could run the world on solar and wind alone; but the science it not yet ready to do so. Therefore, when you attempt to force the issue, you run into economic trouble.
3. Pro-union HAS BECOME anti-business when they demand wages and benefits that are detrimental to that business. Detrimental defined as non-competitive and or insufficient profit. Workers cannot dictate their compensation. The main reason municipalities are going bankrupt is directly proportional to the staggering amounts of benefits paid and or owed to retired union personnel. States and cities can afford police and firefighters but can no longer support them PLUS two generations of retirees…it is just a simple economic fact (please research the numbers as they are staggering). GM went bankrupt for two reasons…paying non-competitive wages/benefits and building inferior automobiles. Although the roles of the UAW have shrunk considerably, they still command compensation that dwarfs that of their competitors and, you cannot run a viable business that way. Also, saying people cannot be terminated even though it appears justified for whatever reason is also antithetical to business. I would never advocate for people to be abused in any manner but compensation and in fact, holding a job must be merit (performance) based. When it isn’t, you get inefficient productivity and inferior product.
4. Nuclear energy is clean and safe. Have there been accidents? Yes. But typically, they have been caused by and or exacerbated by human error and or faulty design. Today, we have mitigated the design flaws and as such, disasters while horrific are microscopic compared to how long the plants have been on line. Again, much of the fear is perpetrated by environmentalists and not based in science or reality.
5. Climate policy and environmental controls HAVE BECOME injurious to business and are getting worse. As stated, I am all for protecting the environment by why only in America? Do we not eventually breathe the same air as in China, SEA and India? Why is the UN always clamping down on America? Why is the EPA forcing us to use an inferior (and, if it breaks, toxic) light bulb? Basically, why is America the only country that must conserve and be clean? You have not addressed this issue from my last post and I’d like to see your answer.
I don't think America is the only nation that needs to conserve to be clean, but we're by far the largest per capita consumer of energy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_use_in_the_United_States), so we're the first in line to start figuring out how to conserve. How can we expect the rest of the world to conserve if we consume far more energy per capita than anyone else?
That said:
1) You're just asserting that because professors are liberal that their science is skewed. Not only is that an assertion with no backup, it doesn't address my original point: unless you are a climate scientist, you have no basis to distinguish between whether NASA and Princeton are right or whether the 1% minority of scientists who doubt climate change are right. You call them the GW crowd, I call them "99% of all scientists". Just because some people doubt them doesn't mean you should too, you need a reason. And "they're liberal" isn't a reason, it's a prejudice.
2) Where are you getting your numbers from? Can you cite anything to suggest US reserves dwarf the middle east? Because they don't. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_proven_oil_reserves Even if all of your numbers were true (and again, why should oil only be $40/barrel?), oil is finite, so it needs to get replaced at some point. Why wait?
3) Why do you believe unions are anti-business? You just assert that they are detrimental to business without providing any specific analysis, examples or numbers. And if you agree with the progress unions have made in the past, why would you want to allow those changes to get rolled back? Wouldn't the criticisms you have now have been true when unions were new?
4) If nuclear was clean and safe, I'd agree with you. But what do you have to support your position? any data?
5) Besides my paragraph above, why do you think flourescent bulbs (which no one is forcing you to use) are inferior? They cost less over time and use less energy and are brighter. Why are they inferior? I thought we want to save costs, isn't flourescent lighting a great way to help the economy save money?
Will Newman – So here we go again with a nonsensical back and forth. I say nonsensical because I’ve addressed your issues in great detail without opinion. No worries, I’ll try again.
1. I have a degree from a State university, have scores of friends and relatives that have degrees and have put children through college. My experience spans many decades and, I am a professional business consultant and serve on the Board of Directors for three additional companies. That said and at the risk of being pedestrian, ‘if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it is indeed a duck. I know what transpires in the university classroom well enough to know most of it is garbage spewed by ideologues-period. They are teaching "WHAT" to think versus "How" to think, which is blatantly wrong.
2. I never stated that America was the only nation that needs to conserve. I said exactly that no other nation is currently held to the standards with which they impose upon us and, that is wrong. We do certainly use a great deal of energy in America but until other nations have a GDP equal to or greater than $15Trillion, so what; and BTW, per capita is meaningless since a country of 315M cannot compete on that basis with countries that easily exceed billions of population. Come on, you are certainly intelligent enough to know this simple math.
3. Again, messing with stats, the Wiki article you site is valid but you missed the operative word – “proven” – as in guaranteed. First of all Wiki, while a fast and often fun resource is subject to revision BY ANYONE at any time so their credibility is (at best) somewhat suspect. IF we include considerations for ANWR, the general arctic zone, and coastal, we have sufficient oil for a very long time…far longer that it would take for us to properly develop the alternatives currently in progress. There is no need for us to allow OPEC and others to bankrupt us while we sit on these reserves. Other countries such as Brazil are not waiting – they are drilling. Further, the environmental movement have successfully prevented a new refinery in the US for over 25-years.
4. There is ample data regarding the safety or nuclear energy just review how many plants have been on line and for how many years they have been in operation and look at the number of dangerous accidents…they are microscopic. The data is available.
5. The ‘new’ light bulbs have two flagrant problems: 1) they contain Mercury; a particularly nasty and dangerous substance which when broken and exposed can cause great environmental and personal health issues. And 2) they are made in China: a) we don’t need any more goods from China and b) we have effectively destroyed yet another entire industry here in America. These bulbs are the same type of agenda driven nonsense I've alluded to in prior posts…we don’t need them. There is no evidence that they burn for longer periods. We have all been through those bogus claims before with standard incandescent and fluorescent bulbs. If there is a savings, I am confident it is marginal at best. So, are they worth putting an entire industry out of business? I think not.
6. Lastly, the subject you did not raise…electric cars. Granted the technology is thankfully coming along albeit slowly. However, I remain extremely intrigued by the fact that NO ONE is discussing or even considering that these vehicles must be charged at least every day…How is electricity generated in this country? We burn coal for most of it. How does that jive with the environmental BS?
The “proof” or documents that you seek are basically everywhere, you just have to look. Additionally, if you want real truth, (and you appear to be someone who does), you need to look beyond the media (networks, blogs, comedians) and read books authored by experts in their field…as many as possible especially those with whom you do not agree. That is when you will have the facts in a well rounded perspective. I trust I’ve made my point.
I trust that you're a well educated and experienced person. But because climate science is a complicated science, general education and experience is insufficient. Unless you have an MD, I wouldn't trust your opinion on whether chemotherapy is lifesaving or dangerous and unless you have a PhD is cosmology, I wouldn't trust your opinion on whether the universe is expanding or contracting. Similarly, educated as you are, unless you have a PhD in climate science, how can you be confident that NASA is wrong and you are right?
I don't understand your second point. We use more energy than other countries, so we have more potential to conserve. What does GDP have to do with that?
Several of your responses include "there is data" or "the data is available". I won't ask you to share the data because you don't need to convince me. I'm just some guy on the internet. But please check this data for yourself. Have you seen it yourself? Where? If you are speculating about the oil in ANWR or something, how can you trust that more than Wikipedia? At least Wikipedia has sources (the page I cited has sources like government filings) Many times I think I saw something, but it turns out, I misremembered it or something. Try and find data supporting the idea that the USA has more oil than the gulf and you may discover that that isn't true.
No one is stopping America from building flourescent bulbs, btw. And electric cars run on much much much less electricity than is used in a combustion engine (designed a hundred years ago btw). Also, electric cars don't have dirty tailpipes polluting the air.
I agree, we should both look to books authored by experts in the field. But when books by experts disagree, unless you're an expert yourself, I still question why you distrust the overwhelming consensus.
Will Newman – Good post Will, thank you. I don't need to be an MD to know if one is giving me bad advice (after independent research and a second opinion of course). As I've stated numerous times, I could not care less what most people think or believe; I find out for myself. When I say "data is available" that is exactly what I mean. However, I'm sure you'll appreciate that I don't have the time to constantly post links or site every book I've read or quote every discussion I've had with experts in the field while traveling. You are entitled to dismiss my position but not my methodology. Suffice it to say, I am satisfied with my conclusions…you are not obligated to agree. I am simply making the point that there is far more to these subjects than what the media tells us, the UN tells us, our enemies say, or what is found on blogs etc. I pride myself on taking the time and making the effort to stay as well informed as possible.
Back to your second paragraph…I did not say I did not trust Wiki, I said I discount Wiki because it can be edited by anyone at any time. Sure there are credible resources but the body of sections can be manipulated. For example, the Wiki article uses the word "proven" to qualify their subsequent statements. I explained that there are many more avenues in which to secure oil than what is currently 'proven" that is all. Also they state that we use more energy PER CAPITA (per person) than other countries. Of course we do because we have far fewer people here and we have a massive GDP (the sum total everything we produce). As such, it takes massive amounts of energy to produce what we produce. In other words, we consumer more because we produce much more.
The GDP list as of 2010: US-$14.5T, China-$5.7T and Japan-$5.5T. Since this massive amount of stuff produced (GDP) is divided by a smaller pool of people (only ~315M or only 4.5% of the world population) it appears as though only a veritable "few" are consuming everything. In reverse, the two highest GDP PER CAPITA countries are Qatar and Luxembourg because of their tiny populations. On that scale the US is still #6. Progressives would have us believe it is because we are a decadent society which is BS. Our standard of living is better than most of the world because we made it so; we earned it.
I’m not sure what you mean by the combustion engine since it uses zero electricity except from a battery to start it…no recharging needed. An electric car must be recharged at least once per day depending on the miles driven. Costs are another story and for some, it may be less expensive that gasoline but not guaranteed. My comments did not concern costs but were tied to the inextricable fact that at least 50% of our electricity is generated by burning coal and I was simply wondering (asking) why the environmental lobby is not concerned.
http://www.edmunds.com/fuel-economy/the-true-cost-of-powering-an-electric-car.html
Finally, I do not believe that one must be an expert to learn things. A person of reasonable intelligence can learn practically anything given the will, the time and the resources. The apparent problem with some “experts” is that they appear to be educated beyond their intelligence…I try hard to avoid that -lol
Anthony De Rubeis – As a scientist myself (my doctoral work is in physics), I can state that in my personal experience I have never encountered or heard of any of my colleagues falsifying data to forward a political agenda. We work incredibly hard, often earning less than we would in the private sector, because we believe that unravelling the hidden truths of the universe is a worthy and admirable goal. The idea of colluding and corrupting the public arena with false information runs counter to the very reason we became scientists.
When people who have never met us, visited our labs or understand the scientific process slander us, it's hard to not be offended. However, I recognize that the offense is a more likely a function of ignorance than malicious intent (probably).
But also, there is no direct link between addressing climate change and promoting socialist ideas. Rep. Bob Ingliss (R-SC) has proposed a solution in the form of revenue neutral carbon tax. The tax would be imposed across the entire market (i.e. not exempting "favored" industries) in a simple, predictable way. This increase would be offset by decreases in payroll taxes. So this plan 1) reduces the tax burden of most workers 2) doesn't reduce government revenue and 3) satisfies the requirement of actually doing something to fix climate change. Remember, this is a Republican proposal. Even if you don't acknowledge climate change is occurring, it's still a net beneficial policy.
Mike Specian – I have always and will continue to respect scientists and have never cast the aspersions of which you accuse me. I never suggested anyone falsified data. Although, as you well know, it has been done several times regarding this and other subjects, I know it is extremely rare. I never attempted to refute that we are warming; I refute that it is unnatural, man made or a crisis.
Appreciating my opening statement, I know that 'both sides' have fallen into the trap that states GW is a crisis. The fact that a Republican (of which I am not) has proposed a plan that appears 'reasonable' does not impress me. My point is given the state of economic affairs, I don't believe it is justified to treat GW as a crisis, disrupt economies, eliminate entire industries etc and or perhaps most importantly, hold these new standards to America alone while China and India continue to make the world a cesspool.
Whether it is economically "worth it" to address climate change is always a debate worth having, if for no other reason than to draw the bright line. But that discussion is a bit more than this limited comment forum can handle. The number I've heard thrown around is that dedicated mitigation would cost about 2% of GDP, but keep your eyes open to numbers from other sources.
237+ years of blood in vein so a scholar can decide what is taught going forward. History is powerful in the right or wrong hands.
Pay attention folks! Make sure your kids are well informed on the true American history and not dictated by government. Go buy old history books before they are burned. Hmmm.. I've heard of that happening in past history.
Pay attention folks! Make sure your kids are well informed on the true American history and not dictated by government. Go buy old history books before they are burned. Hmmm.. I've heard of that happening in past history.
You are right about that. Although they aren't "burning books" like they used to, they are simply editing history out of them or rewriting it with every new edition.
Actually, as in Texas and Louisiana, they're editing out SCIENCE.
Next thing you know Republicans are going to want to be referred to as gods.The Republican party has become the party of lies , hate and exhibits extreme un- American values.
It's clear your grasp on reality failed some time ago, or you wouldn't have said something so ridiculous. Republicans are bad… Democrats are many orders of magnitude worse. I was a Democrat for 30 years.. then watched the party become the festering malignant entityit is today. You only have to look at the likes of Pelosi, Reid, Obama, and (ugh) Wasserman-Schultz to see how rotten the apple is. None of them are remotely in touch with America or Americans… From what i hear coming from their own mouths, they hate America passionately.
We are trying to fix the mess that Bush created .Yet all you Republicans do is obstruct and abuse the filibuster .You guys clearly don't care about our problems.You just keep creating more.
We are trying to fix the mess that Bush created .Yet all you Republicans do is obstruct and abuse the filibuster .You guys clearly don't care about our problems.You just keep creating more.
Dems agreed to put away the filibuster provided Bush stopped nominating losers like Harriet Myers for the SCOTUS. Then Obama comes in and the GOP uses the filibuster like they change underwear. Hypocrites.
@Jeff and @Dan – you guys are hilarious. Let me guess, you get your "information" from the networks and liberal blogs right? Why are you so satisfied with posting regurgitations of baseless propaganda found on Media Matters, Move On, Daily Kos, A-Huffs Post etc.? Do you guys actually read ANYTHING else?
No, that is a measurable FACT. The FACT that the Dems agreed to limit use of the filibuster is a FACT. It was all made public knowledge. Even the GOP didn't like Harriet Myers. The FACT that the GOP has used the filibuster a record number of times during the Obama years is again a measurable FACT. Has nothing to do with Media Matters or any other boogeyman you choose.
Once again you are putting words in my posts that don't exist…fail. The filibuster is a legitimate tool and whether the Congress agreed to use it or not is irrelevant. The minority party always has the ability to use whatever legal tools are available-period. What you fail to mention is that liberals have run Congress for a very long time. Since Conservatives have control of the House for the last two years and secured that small majority by sweeping margins, what would we have them do rubber stamp everything our Socialist leader wants? Everything the liberal Harry Reid wants? I think not. Ignorance of how our government is designed to function is breathtaking. Since 2010, Conservatives "control" one-half of one-third of the government-that's it. Unfortunately, the expectations of that small group is overwhelming given the progressive agenda they are faced with and the state of spending vs revenue that exists. Since the progressive agenda includes spending us into oblivion which is economically insane, what should Conservatives do? You and those who think as you do, are clueless as to the damage this fool is doing. I could go on but I'll leave you with a FACT. You really want to know who has done the damage to this country? Since between 1945 and 2009 Democrats have controlled the House of Representatives all but 7-years and the Senate all but 10. Since the media is liberal and control basically 98% of what many hear as "news and information," I can only laugh, then get angry whey they continually assign blame for our profound issues. And, before you put words into my post again, I'll state very clearly…I am NOT saying Conservatives are omnipotent and perfect; I am NOT saying liberals are to blame for everything; but I am saying progressives are systematically destroying this country and for those that don't see it, I feel sorry for them but they are part of the problem.
Am I living in California again instead of Nebraska?
I agree. I also wish that schools would teach our children about the real history of our country. such as George washington was NOT the first president of the united states. Washington was thus the fifteenth in a long line of distinguished presidents—and he led the seventeenth administration—he just happened to be the first under the current constitution. However they do not teach the articles of confederation in schools anymore. It is sad.
The culture that is filling our prisons and failing schools with their social programs, is now trashing what made us great. Just another kenyan clown plan to trash the United States.
We need another Ronald Reagan….fire all the assholes and start over…Shame on all Nebraska Educators…They should leave our country if they desire…and leave us…the stupid people alone….We will be better off without them…Unbelievable….
Don't believe everything you hear in the media…there are some real good and real smart people out there here in the US…there are also real good and real smart people in China…and India…and Japan…
Chill…just chill…
And most of them were likely educated here.
NAME SOME NAMES…. Who authored the draft? If it was a committee… WHO was on the committee. Shine the light on these cockroaches and do not allow them to scurry off.
Sad..that about says it all.